One of the main reasons I purchased the D200 was because of the WiFi feature. Here's my situation.
I want my D200 to talk to my G4 Mac without a cord.
I want my images to go directly from my camera to my laptop which will about 7 feet away.
The event I will be shooting will require me to shoot about 350-500 shots under 25 minutes. I understand that transfer data off a WiFi is only as fast as the data transfer the ISP will allow.
Assuming I shoot raw or high jpeg, I am looking at 2.5meg+ files. I assume that the pictures obviously won't refresh onto the monitor realtime. My concern was that ALL the images get to hard-drive eventually.
Will a WT-3 transfer hundreds of files over time if I shoot that many in such a short amount of time? Or will the WT-3 ping out eventually, not letting all my photos get to a hard-drive.
My clients want a DVD burned ASAP after the event, and everyone knows how slow it takes to transfer a large file via... USB. Normally takes me about 23 minutes to transfer a 2gig CF card to my laptop. So I'd rather shoot on the fly and let it transfer.
Or does the file transfers via WiFi stop eventually? I can see how it can work taking some studio work, doing one shot at time or 5-10 per round. But how about mass amounts?
Also... Does WT-3 allow the user to acquire image into internet & CompactFlash card as well?
#1. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 0Brian_A Charter MemberWed 17-Jan-07 09:49 AM
Instead of utilizing infrastructure mode FTP transfer I recommend establishing a adhoc connection with the PC and specify a storage folder. Your transfer rates will be generally higher. Also, unless the locale of the event has a (public) Wi-Fi infrastructure network available you could not use that mode for FTP transfer anyway.
You can transfer a RAW or full jpeg image in a few seconds. However, you should be aware that the connection will time-out and reconnect (automatically) if too much time passes between image transfers. This is a power saving feature. If immediate availability (for display) is not an issue then I suggest leaving the Wi-Fi off and transfer the images in groups while near your computer because it will take less time and power because the signal will be stronger and the battery power is not wasted (possibly) loosing and making connections all the time instead of sending images.
In the end you must realize that you only have one battery powering the camera and WT-3. You will change batteries more frequently. If the G4 has thw ability to directly read a CF cart (even through a USB reader) and immediate availability of DVD after the event is the issue then I suggest using smaller cards and transferring them during the event while you are shooting. Better battery life, much less expensive (a USB reader is <$30) and possibly faster availability.
I don't know what you mean by an internet CF card. byt any viable FTP destination or filepath on a adhoc networked PC can be a destination for the transferred images. If your PC setup is stable enough then yhat path can even reside on the burnable DVD thereby saving you that extra step.
#2. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 0Bill Spangler Charter MemberWed 17-Jan-07 11:34 AM
I may not be thinking right here, but 23 minutes to transfer 2 Gb seems like an awfully long time to me. Are you transferring directly from your camera or a card reader? When I was transferring that way, it took me 18-20 minutes to transfer 2 Gb. Then I bought a card reader and the transfer time went down to 2 to 3 minutes.
#4. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 3cvjarrod Registered since 18th Nov 2006Wed 17-Jan-07 02:58 PM
Bandwidth will be limited by the WT-3. It pegs out at 10 megabits / second in wireless mode.
For a 15 megabyte Raw file, that means it will take a minimum of:
15 / (10/8) = 12 seconds. Assumming 20% bandwidth loss, you'll probably be downloading one raw image every 15 seconds or so.
You could also take advantage of the built in ethernet interface in the WT-3 and that would give you a maximum bandwitdth of 15 megabits/second.
I'm not sure why you mention an ISP.
Basically, you configure you're wireless router, camera and computer to communicate and you can use the Nikon programs to automatically download the pictures to the computer. Keep in mind that the router will need a 110V AC source of power. Bring everything to the shoot location, provide power and it will work just like it did at home.
If you have a clear line of site between the WT-3 and the router, distances of up to 100' shouldn't degrade the signal enough to effect the relatively slow speeds of the WT-3. Once again, testing at home will give you exact performance numbers.
My guess is that the yet unreleased WT-4 will ditch the proprietary design and support native 802.11g. This would give 54 megabit / second bandwidth and would support downloading 15 Megabyte raw files at about three seconds per shot. It will also be even more power hungry than the WT-3.
#5. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 0
the non-wifi version should be weighed against wifi b/c of battery life, yes.
if you decide to go wifi b/c you have more batteries than CF cards, or don't want to 'break' beswides swapping batteries, etc, then a a few tips.
802.11b = 11 mb/sec theoretical, hope for 7mb/sec
801.11g = 54 mb/sec theoretical, hope for 30mb/sec
(mb = mega bit, not Byte)
the latter figures are "throughput" and can vary greatly, from Bandwidth
7mb/sec = 0.875 mB/sec (megabyte) or ~3+ seconds per 2.5mB file.
30mb/sec = 3.75 mB/sec (megabyte) or ~.7 seconds per 2.5mB file.
So, how do you get to the upper end and try to keep your throughput (reality) closer to the rated bandwidth (theoretical max)?
1) don't be near any microwave ovens or old-school flourescent lamp ballasts, lots of power cables, hvac ductwork, or A/C-patch panels.
2) lock your AP (access point - assuming you're using infrastructure) to 802.11G (only) not "mixed mode" - which will "downshift" to .b to allow older clients to log on - even someone just 'checknig you out'
3) channel selection
the last one is the biggie, not only can it slow you down but result in the "here now, gone a minute late, whoa, it's back; ugh, it's gone --repeat" scenario.
the better APs (like the HP 420 models i like) do dynamic channel hunting, so that they pick the 'emptiest' of the channels (it's 1 - 11, in North Am., think of 'em like CB channels) - and move as needed- but they're not cheap (sure, 50% less than cisco, but 5x the price of the linksys WAP54G you may have at home). what to do?
you didn't specify, but if you have a windos laptop with a wifi card, before you get to the site, fetch "cain and able" http://www.oxid.it/cain.html a nice hacker program (got a mac? search "os x promiscuous mode wifi" in google and you see plenty of tools -some command line, some GUI)
One of the benefits of C&A is that you can use it to scan surroundnig wifi networks - they give antena power, vendor, ssid, encryption method, and most importantly - their channels, in a nice tablular format - including "hidden" ssids (a joke security method, but i digress) - hidden one's still matter as they can slow down your bandwidth as you 'fight' for packet space in the ethernet-like collision domain, ie: find them and avoid those channels.
this allows you to pick the best channel for you (ie: emptiest) and set your nodes to use it.
You also need to decide if you want an ad-hoc network (camera via radio "directly" to PC/Mac) , or an infrastructure mode (an AP** as intermediary), the latter is more secure and more robust against people coming into 'your' channel since the start of your session.
**I said "AP" but it should be a "wireless router" really, with all 'clients' on the LAN side (igore the 'wan' or 'Internet' jack), so that the DHCP server in it can keep your IP addresses squared away, so a WRT54G (non speedbooster model, no "s" at the end of the name) is a cheap and reliable and ubiqutous one.
i've been thinking about that device and any info on range or batt.life would be appreciated.
btw, your problem with that long USB file transfer sounds like usb 1.1 bottle neck:
11mb/s = 1.375mB/s. 2000mB/1.375mB/s = 1454.54 seconds / 60 seconds = 24 min.
#6. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 5Wed 17-Jan-07 06:23 PM
Thanks for the info everyone. This is all new to me.
I come from a filming/editing background, so please forgive my still camera ignorance hehe. Here is my current gear:
An Airport express card
A 250gig 7200rpm external hard-drive
It sounds like the wireless option will be too slow regardless of what I try to do and has a chance to stop data transfer if I overload it and the channels would be a scary thing to have to worry about if people decided to tap in during the event.
So the option I would be willing to try is hard wiring my camera to a Mac formatted hard-drive or directly to the laptop via firewire or USB. If this is a possible route, what software/hardware would I need exactly to make this work?
as for the internet CF thing I said earlier, I meant (will it capture to both wireless AND to the compact flash card inside the camera?) sorry it was getting late and almost passed out writing this.
As for why I am doing this, I feel that I can rack in more clients if I can provide a service that turns around pictures the fastest way possible to a client onto a DVD for the type of stuff I film.
#7. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 6getz76 Registered since 19th Sep 2006Wed 17-Jan-07 08:00 PM
Okay, let us get simple.
How many CF cards and what capacity and speed are they?
If you have enough cards that are fast enough, try this:
1. Boot up laptop.
2. Connect a good card reader (like this Sandisk if your laptop has a 6-pin Firewire port available)
3. Take pictures.
4. Fill up cards.
5. Take cards out and plug them in to card reader.
6. Copy cards to laptop hard drive.
7. Burn DVDs.
With fast CF cards and that reader, you are talking about a really quick turn around.
This will be the quickest method. Your main problem is the card reader you are using. My Dell X1 has a built CF card reader, but it is insanely slow and takes about 30 minutes to copy a 150X 4gb card. I have a cheap-o Meritline 12-1 reader that does about 500 MB/minute that I carry around with that Dell X1. When I have my Hyperdrive Space with me, it is even faster.
#8. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 7Wed 17-Jan-07 09:07 PM
I will be armed with four 2gig Sandisc Ultra II's. Not going to go through them all probably, but the hard part will be switching the cards out. It will be a live event, so I'd like to avoid minimal downtime as I switch.
I used a 4gig before but the card took a dive during an event. So I prefer using slightly smaller storage, where I don't have to worry about putting all the eggs in 1 basket.
I've used the multiple compact flash cards then copy after but after I am done with the evening, I'm looking at over an hour to transfer. I know there are people out there who are doing "timed" pictures. This person did this time lapse onto a PC laptop via his Canon 20D. I don't know the technical specs as to how fast he can shoot, but if he just mounts his tripod up, it can take pictures at slower rates. What would be the equivilent option for the Nikon? And can it handle a buffer of hundreds of pics being thrown at it?
The WT-3 option looks nice, but looks like I will be saving it for more studio work.
How much did you guys pay for yours on average? I can't seem to find it anywhere for sale.
>Okay, let us get simple.
>How many CF cards and what capacity and speed are they?
>If you have enough cards that are fast enough, try this:
>1. Boot up laptop.
>2. Connect a good card reader (like this
>if your laptop has a 6-pin Firewire port available)
>3. Take pictures.
>4. Fill up cards.
>5. Take cards out and plug them in to card reader.
>6. Copy cards to laptop hard drive.
>7. Burn DVDs.
>With fast CF cards and that reader, you are talking about a
>really quick turn around.
>This will be the quickest method. Your main problem is the
>card reader you are using. My Dell X1 has a built CF card
>reader, but it is insanely slow and takes about 30 minutes
>to copy a 150X 4gb card. I have a cheap-o Meritline 12-1
>reader that does about 500 MB/minute that I carry around
>with that Dell X1. When I have my Hyperdrive Space with me,
>it is even faster.
#9. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 0
As a follow-up I ran a few trials to provide data to anyone who cares. I placed my camera on a tripod, set image size/quality to large/fine jpeg and set a manual exposure to keep image size about the same size (about 4,000 kB). I configured the wirless networking for adhoc mode. The computer (a Sony Vaio PC330P/B) was operating in "g" mode. THe PC was 40 separated from the camera by 40 feet (medium signal strength). In all cases I used a stopwatch to measure the time from the (initial) shutter release until the (final) image appeared in Windows Explorer. For the 10 image batch downloads the images were captured in a few seconds in continous high-speed mode.
- It takes approx. 28 secs to establish a connection and and download a single image (about 4,000 kB).
- If a connection is already established the download takes approx. 8 secs.
- It takes approx. 62 seconds to establish a connection and download 10 images (about 41 MB) consecutively to the PC.
- If a connection is already established the download takes approx. 48 secs. to download 10 images consecutively to the PC.
I know it is not scientific but it is representative of my general experience with the WT-3.
#10. "RE: WT-3 users" | In response to Reply # 0
Stitch, if you are using the WT-3 in PC mode (meaning you can use Camera Control Pro to control the camera functions remotely) the image data is deleted from the card when the image is transferred. Using Transfer mode gives you several options, including Auto Send (whether or not to automatically send the images, or wait for your command to do it), Delete after send (I believe this answers your question!), and Send file as (which allows you to send JUST the JPG, or both NEF and JPG).
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