Congratulations on your purchase. That said, $250 is nowhere near incentive enough for me to get a used gray market version of the D3 but that is just me and not a criticism of you. You are a braver man then me.
Well you did say it was in the "Used Department. I assumed that it was used since you only got a 90 day warranty. Even a gray market item has a year's warranty. It just will not be serviced by NikonUSA.
Nevertheless, you got a gray market D3 with a 90 day warranty and saved only $250 and you are an employee of B&H? I would think you would get a pretty decent employee discount.
Discount on cameras is negligible. We don't make very much on them.
Discount on items that the manufacturer's discount is very good. I'm getting a set of profoto lights for almost 1k off normal pricing.
Nikon doesn't plan on putting the D3 on the employee purchase list anytime soon. So I figure, Nikon gear is reliable, I can have it now and enjoy it and produce great images, or I can keep pining and waiting. Now I have a backup camera finally, which is something I should have had a while ago (I didn't consider my N80 a reasonable backup to my D200).
If the D3 you talked about is "brand new", why it is available on the "used department"? How many bodies left are available under this 90 days and are they used or new? Is it possible that you e-mail me if you see that new bodies arrive at B&H, since it only lasts for a few hours? thanks for any response.
BH doesn't stock new gray market digital bodies in the new department because they get no price protection. However, the used department can buy small quantities, like 10-15 at a time. So Gray market items in the used department are brand new. Just have to change the language from japanese the first time you turn it on. You get a three month warranty instead of a one year warranty.
We had 13 yesterday, I bought one, and then one other person bought one. When I left work yesterday, there were 11 left. I don't work today, so I don't know how many there are right now. I expect most will be gone by tomorrow, when I return to work, as I told the sales people in the new department that we had the gray market versions in, since the new department has no US versions.
>As a long-time B&H customer, I am puzzled as to why Nikon >allows B&H to sell Gray market products to US buyers at >all???
I have no problems with B&H selling gray market items. They are clearly marked and there is an explanation what gray market is all about. They are selling gray market items ethically (i.e. the customer knows what they are getting). The same cannot be said about many other retailers. That said, I would never buy a gray market DSLR or a more sophisticated (technology wise) lens. I do not see why Nikon or NikonUSA would care what B&H sells. It is not as if NikonUSA loses money supporting gray market items because there isn't any support and Nikon is selling more cameras. The old adage "you get what you pay for" applies here.
Wed 27-Feb-08 01:33 PM | edited Wed 27-Feb-08 01:34 PM by Jose Andres
Thanks johnatan for the input of the gray market alternative in B&H. I have just placed the order on the phone and I am expecting to receive the body within 2 days. AS to this body, the sales representative on the used department told me that this item is brand new. The only difference is that it comes with a 90 days warranty and it has a discount in price because of being a gray market product. Since I do not live in the USA, I have been purchasing products from B&H since 2002, all gray market products,and never, ever had any problem whatsoever. So, for me, the gray market body works. In the event I have a problem with the body, after this 90 days, I know a guy, who was the technician of the Nikon Argentina Dealer, and who so far works for himself. He is a reliable guy and I am happy to know that I could resort to him, eventually.
And I am aware of the warranty issues, but to date, I have never needed an in warranty repair on any item I have ever purchased. I'm not worried that things will be tough for me. If after the warranty period I need to get things fixed, I'm willing to pay for service, and I live in New York, so finding a repair shop won't be hard.
And secondly, I am loving this camera, I am in the middle of a trade for cd shoot right now. It's so smooth, like butter.
If you live somewhere besides the US, great. But Nikon USA declining to work on the gray market camera is purported to be a forever deal, not merely their declining to repair them for free under any warranty period. While I'd be delighted to be proven wrong on this point, so far no one has stepped up to the plate to say in the affirmative that Nikon USA willingly accepts gray market repairs.
Anyone living in the USA and contemplating such a purchase, call around to some of these non-Nikon USA repair houses supposedly able to work on them, specifically to ask them the present availability of all the major and minor components for a D3. Let us know what you find out. Can't imagine that all of the thousands of parts that go into a D3 are easily obtained, or that they can calibrate all the sub assemblies as can Nikon USA. This is not exactly your daddy's F2 we're talking about here.
Thank you again for your help. Tomorrow, hopefully, I will be receiving my brand new D3, in the end.
Here are some questions:
1)as to your previous post, I did not understand this sentence:
"BH doesn't stock new gray market digital bodies in the new department because they get no price protection. However, the used department can buy small quantities, like 10-15 at a time. So Gray market items in the used department are brand new".
So, what do you mean about this "no price protection"?.
2) is there any difference between a gray market product of the new deparment (from which I have been purchasing all of my current lenses) and this gray market product from the used department?
3) Have you seen that B&H offers D3 bodies into "available kits" on their website? Are this bodies available or not?. And, if so, are the same bodies you have been talking about? My concern here is about the 90 days warranty. I don't know if these bodies come with a 1 year warranty or only this 90 days.
BH has two buying divisions. The New and Used. New is the majority of the items in the store. New doesn't buy Gray market digital bodies, because the prices fluctuate on them too much. For example, if they bought 1000 pieces, and a week later, the price goes down 200 dollars a unit, the manufacturer will reimburse, or credit the difference of 200 dollars for those 1000 pieces. That can be a HUGE amount of money.
However, Gray market, those items purchased from importers, do not come with such protection. The Used Department D3s came directly from Japan. Not through Nikon USA, however, BH only bought 13. We knew we would sell out in a matter of days, and we did. When I left work this afternoon we only had 1 or 2 left. The Used department can do this though, because we have our own budget. So we buy small amounts of desirable items, and they are sold for less money than the US versions.
As for the warranty:
If you buy a US D3, you only have the one year warranty in the US. If you buy a Gray Market, you have a 90-Day Warranty Worldwide. So if you live outside the US, the gray market is actually the better deal for you. We sell most of our gray market items to Europeans in fact.
Again, many thanks for all your feedback. Now, I can understand in full what you said about the grey market in B&H. AS we both mentioned, since I am not living in the US, I always purchase grey market products and hopefully, I have never had any problem.
Just for curiosity, in my 3rd question of my last response, I was asking you whether or not you saw D3 bodies available as kits. Perhaps, you already saw this thread:
The New department sells gray market lenses because lens prices don't fluctuate.
Sometimes the used department gets the gray market lenses, and they are actually cheaper than the ones in the new department, despite being the EXACT same thing.
I have seen that with the 18-70 AF-S DX lens. Imported from New was 270, and Imported from Used (for a new lens) was 249. Go figure.
Working in the Used department is the best. It's relaxed, I get all the perks of working in the new department, in a laid back atmosphere. And honestly, there is a larger profit market in used, so I can spend more time chatting with customers about photography, and it doesn't affect performance. Builds great repeat business, and some of the people we meet are awesome photographers.
thanks for clarifying the gray market situation in both department. Until now, I did not realise that gray market lenses in the used department could be brand new, since I supposed that all of them are used, as the name of the department implies.
However, I agree with you about the different atmosphere in both department. I visited B&H in october 2002 and I was alwyas hurried by the employes of the new department. At times, some salespersons could become rude at a customer. I have 2 exceptions: a bolivian man (whose name I cannot recall now) and another from Mexico, both of them were excellent guys and I have a very good rememberance of them. In the used department, I remembered that all was calm and friendly and the guy who assisted me (a tall guy perhaps in his mid fifties) was excellent. I purchased there my FM2n body.
That was probably Chris. He's been there like 12 years, and knows a lot of the vintage cameras.
Very friendly guy. If you're ever in New York again, you'll see BH has changed a lot, doubled the physical size of the store, and the Used Department is a lot larger. I'm basically the head of the used digital right now.
wow Johnatan. Congratulations! Your position there is quite impressive. I am looking forward to visiting NY again, so perhaps in the future, I will be there and if so, I will go to meet you personally. I now remember the name of the bolivian man: "Leo", is he still working in the new department? Nice guy. thanks a lot again for your help. If if weren't by your post, I would have never got a D3 body so fast, especially after you warned all nobody would get a D3 body on B&H website.
hi Mark. Although I am not an expert of camera business, gray market seems to be a cheaper market for non US residents, and with no price protection as Johnatan clearly explained in this thread. Since people who don't live in the US, like me, would be useless to purchase a body or lens with american warranty, big stores, like B&H and others alike, meets these peoples' needs by alowing a more convenient market for them to buy, and that is why these D3 brand new but belonging to the gray market at 4750 (250 dollars less than regular US body price) met my needs, so I ended up ordering one body for me. I think Johantan is the most appropriate to give you a better idea than me. Hope it helps.
>hi Mark. Although I am not an expert of camera business, gray >market seems to be a cheaper market for non US residents, and >with no price protection as Johnatan clearly explained in this >thread. >Since people who don't live in the US, like me, would be >useless to purchase a body or lens with american warranty, big >stores, like B&H and others alike, meets these peoples' >needs by alowing a more convenient market for them to buy, and >that is why these D3 brand new but belonging to the gray >market at 4750 (250 dollars less than regular US body price) >met my needs, so I ended up ordering one body for me. >I think Johantan is the most appropriate to give you a better >idea than me. Hope it helps. > > >Jose, nikonian >from Santiago del Estero, Argentina >http://joseandresbasbus.zenfolio.com
Tue 04-Mar-08 11:11 PM | edited Wed 05-Mar-08 02:02 AM by Jose Andres
I received yesterday the new D3 body from the used department. I have one concern of which I would appreciate your advice.
In the D3 box, it comes out a label which says that Capture NX is included. However, the only cd-rom into the box is a black one labeled "nikon software suite", which does not include capture.
I have installed the software and after the instalation was complete, I saw that there is a link to Nikon website to download a "free trial 30 days version of Capture NX", of which I am downloading now. So, after the instalation is complete, it is supposed that after running capture nx in my laptop for the first time, I have to enter the licence number that comes as a small label on the D3 box?
Or, I have to contact B&H and inform that in my box there is not the capture NX software? Thanks for your help.
RECENT UPDATE OF THIS THREAD. I have just found on nikon website the answer of this question and it can be located here:
the problem I see with my purchase in B&H is that the box did not include the NX key card, as Nikon indicates, so I am waiting for a response to an e-mail I sent to them. Johnatan, I will apreciate your help as well.
After downloading, I open the software for the first time, and it request (of what I remember) a number licence of 16 digits, separate in four rows of 4. The licence number that is put in the small label on the D3 box is below the words: "nikon d3 digital srl camera" and consists of 7 digits, beginning with number 0, so it does not match with the one requested by the software. So, perhaps I have to look somewhere else?
I am interested in obtaining this software and because the D3 Box comes with one, I have the right to claim it. Just in case, the problem I encountered is that the box did not include the NX key card, as Nikon indicates in their website, so I am still waiting for a response to an e-mail I sent to B&H (Request# INQ647056). I look forward to your reply. Thanks in advance again.
I would strongly appreciate if you could help me with the NX licence code. I claimed at the Used Department and they said that they had mailed me -on March 10th- a box with a software. As of today, I have not received any parcel, so I decided to phone the Used Deparment. After getting assisted by Mr. ABE, he asked me to called him back within few hours. After doing so, he told me that the software they had sent me was the basic cd-rom of view nx, which, of course, is not Capture NX. He told me that he could send me again this cd-rom, but I claimed that what I was looking for was the licence code of the NX which was included in the D3 box. He responded that the Used Department is currently selling bodies without it and that information could be checked in b&h website in the items included with the D3 body. So, it seems that I am deprived of something I have the right to claim.
Could you tell me if the body you also purchased, like me, at the Used Department, came with either NX cd-rom or licence code? In addition, could you look into, as you stated before, in the Used Department and give me some help? Last but not least, if I had to register the D3 body to obtain the code via e-mail, as Voodoo stated,could you tell me where to do that? thanks for your help.
thanks Voodoo for your question. SInce my body is gray market, where I have to register it, in Japan? According to nikon website, the D3 box (with the capture nx label) is supposed to include a XN softare licence card, which mine did not include, according to what I stated before.
The Nikon Website you have referred to in this thread is the NikonUSA website. Unless I am missing something, you got a gray market D3 and not a NikonUSA D3. Gray market D3s may not come with free Capture NX.
Sat 29-Mar-08 07:28 PM | edited Sat 29-Mar-08 07:34 PM by Jose Andres
HELLO MEL. Thanks for your opinion.
You may be right. I found this info in the Nikonusa website, but I think that Nikon Japan (where my body comes from) should behave the same way.
Since the box came with the label indicating that NX was included, anybody can come to the conclusion that Nikon, the manufacturer, put this label on the box and hence, the sofware should be included, regardless of the fact that you (in this case me) is buying a body with a 90 days warranty, since it is a brand new item and I have the right to claim that licence key. Otherwise, I will be receiving a box with one item missing, something that I will not consent. B&H has the obligation to control that the boxes (of brand new bodies) they buy in their Used Department, includes this product key licences as long as these boxes come with that label. As it is a limited campaign, it is expected that Nikon stops doing this sometime in the future but, mine, has that label and should include that product key.
It would be interesting that Johnatan, as a nikonian who works in this specific Department of B&H, could give his opinion, as I asked him. Let's hope he can help me with this issue. I insisted with my claim at B&H and they accepted to contact the manufacturer to ask this question. Although this is good news, so far, it does not necessarily mean that they will send me the missing item.
In sum, gray market is a USA market and does not have any relationship with Nikon Japan as a manufacturer. This label belongs to Nikon and if they put it on a box it means that they should include the product key into each box labeled accordingly. Gray market buys boxes that come already with this feature, so they don't add or deprive the box of anything else.