What changes you'd like on the D3 !?
let's say the D3 is on the making, what would you like to see in it !?
I own a D2H and what I'd like to see on the D3H is:
10 to 12 MP on the D3H
Better noise with high ISO, (maybe ISO starting at 100)
10 or 12 FPS would be SICK.
no care to much about a FF sensor.
how about you.!
#1. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0TBS Registered since 16th May 2006Wed 27-Jun-07 11:54 AM
I would like:
--Long exposure technology/noise reduction. I'd like to shoot star trails like I did with film. No image stacking. (This is a pipe dream, but that is what I would like).
--Viewfinder, viewfinder, viewfinder! I want a 35mm-ish large viewfinder. Whether they do this with a FF sensor or some other technology I don't care. My FM2n destroys my D1x in manual focusing ability. Since I own some great quality AI/AIS primes, I use them a lot on my D1x. I would be very happy if the D3 had a viewfinder as sharp and clear as a 35mm film body. Generally you need FF for this, which is why I would like to see Nikon offer FF in the future. If they came up with some other technique to give a viewfinder as big as a 35mm camera (and just as easy to MF with)while still maintaining Dx size, I would be ok with that too.
--Dynamic range improvments. Blowing highlights on my D1x is no fun. .
--High ISO is not a big deal to me, although having a very, very, usable range up to 800 is sufficient for my style of photography. I would enjoy a LOWER base ISO. At least 100, maybe even down to 50 or 25 would be kind of nice. I generally like to "slow" down the motion of my subjects while retaining a nice depth of field. It is easiest to control this on hot days with slower ISO speeds. Problem is, is if it is base ISO at 50, that means your high ISO noise probably won't be as good. Maybe a D3h that has an ISO from 200-3200, and a D3x with 50-800 and a usable 1200 would be a pretty nice "dream" lineup.
--MP isn't that big a deal to me. Give me a D2x-ish 12MP with twice the dynamic range, and I would be happy.
Anyway, that is my dream.
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#5. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 1DrJay32 Nikonian since 12th Mar 2003Wed 27-Jun-07 03:05 PM
-ISO 50-3200, with HI-1 setting being 6400. Clean images through at least ISO 1600.
-Better control of luminance noise at all ISOs
-more dynamic range
-8 FPS without HSC (assuming a DX sensor), 5 FPS if FF
-if FF, enough pixel density to make a crop mode worth using
-integrated terminal caps like the F6
-built-in Wi-Fi and GPS (why not?)
-a manual that actually explains how to use the AF system
Jason P. Odell
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#22. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 5matteliot Registered since 16th Mar 2006Sat 30-Jun-07 02:34 PM
>-built-in Wi-Fi and GPS (why not?)
Ditto- they've now got WiFi cards in SD and CF formats, I can't see why this can't be built-in instead of a ~$500 extra brick I've got to attach. The FTP software, etc, is trivial.
How about a battery that I can just eject and slam a new one into without needing to put the 'carrier' back onto the end?
#4. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
I want an a "reinvented" open DSLR architecture ... interchangeable sensor backs that connect to a "future-proofed" body bus that's standardized across generations. In other words, new bodies would work with older backs and vise versa until technology advances required a break in compatibility with the past to move forward.
Backs could be specialized; extreme High ISO performance, amazing DR or higher resolution, etc.
License the architecture and enter into contracts with the best and brightest companies to extend the offerings by supplying new components.
But I'd be happy to see any of the following...faster sensor, less noise, more DR, a configurable viewfinder indicator and audible alert that lets me know instantly if my focus area (plus a user configurable percentage) has clipped shadows or blown highlights, more/smaller/faster/configurable AF sensors, built-in viewfinder magnifier and split prism focus screen
#6. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
On my budget I'm unlikely to ever see a D3, but I will certainly see the images it takes in print. So...
The world's first 35mm HOLOGRAPHIC digital camera!
#7. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
With 4 stops more of DR and low noise to ISO 3200, I'm sold.
What I don't want changed is the size and shape of the camera and the position of all the controls. I want to be able to use all my accessories.
#8. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 7DVDMike Registered since 25th Mar 2003Wed 27-Jun-07 07:24 PM
I'd keep the D2X as it is today with the following additions/changes:
At least 3 stops improvement over the D2X in terms of noise, more if possible.
Redundant CF card storage.
Focus lock on camera so that it requires more effort to change the focus mode (this one has bit me many times!).
More Dynamic Range than the D2X offers now.
Improved low light AF performance.
Sensor "cleaning" system.
Built in wireless.
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#9. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 8Martin Turner Nikonian since 19th Jun 2006Wed 27-Jun-07 08:19 PM
I'm not that bothered by D2X noise, but I would like to see more dynamic range.
I also like the idea of a modular camera. If Nikon could persuade me that the D3 was the last camera I ever had to buy, I would probably get one and quite happily carry on upgrading sensors, viewfinders and other stuff for years to come.
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#23. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 8maxbox51 Registered since 21st Apr 2006Tue 03-Jul-07 08:31 PM
I'd be dumbfounded if it is physically possible to get 3 stops better noise performance without increasing pixel size, i.e. reducing resolution. Current sensors already capture 95% of the incident light, there's less than 0.1 stops theoretically available there. I doubt there is 1 stop of light lost in the current generation of microlenses and filter dyes, although a different filter pattern (such as a YCYM Bayer pattern) might provide as much as 1 stop--but cause color drift in highlights. Sensor noise is also already very low, close to the limit defined by stochastic variation in photon arrivals at typical indoor light levels over about 1/60 sec (okay that exposure time is a guess, but it probably isn't far off). I think the least noisy cameras have about half the noise of the D2X, so there might be as much as a 1 stop gain available.
If you really want a 3 stop improvement in noise, something else will have to give.
#11. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
Improved high-ISO performance. I'd be satisfied if they could get at 3200 what they presently get at 1600. Even better performance would be desirable, of course.
1/500 (non FP) flash sync, so I can really kill the ambient in gyms and on fields with nasty sodium lights.
Other things would be nice to have (8 FPS non-HSC, more DR, etc), but the above two are the ones I would most like to see.
Wethersfield, CT, USA
Connecticut High School Sports Photos
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#12. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
Nikon should go on following the idea of "one body does everything" - the D2X was a good first shot in my books. Don´t like this separation between a "fine arts / studio" camera and a "sports / action" camera.
Dyn. Range / Noise / ISO - would like to see the same ISO settings offered then with the D2H(s) yielding at least same noise levels. Dynamic Range should be wider as said above allready.
AF-System - appart from the fact that Nikon should clearly explain what it does and what not (without the need to find out everything by having to read articles from Thom Hogan, Bjorn Roslett etc. pp.). They should stop offering AF-modes which cause more headache to the photographer then they are of any use. Remember the eyesight-triggered AF system of another vendor? Same thing - nice idea but practically useless. When i first time read about photogs which shoot plain AF-S or AF-C, single sensor i thought "well, those guys are purists" but soon found out that they´re right doing so. All this dynamic bla-bla-bla may work well in the lab or if you can exactly think & decide like the camera - if not they´re simply useless. Dear Nikon - remember - sometimes lesser is more!
AF-Metering switch - could we PLS change this dmnd thing to a push-button like FUNC? It´s not intuitive to push and turn if you don´t want to move your eye away from the shutter.
C/S/M-switch - same here - this relict of the past should be replaced by a button like the FUNC is.
LCD-Display - nice the bigger it gets and the more resolution it offers BUT can we color-calibrate it?
Histogram - PLS Nikon, can we get a WYSIWYG-version?!? It´s ridiculous that Capture NX (or NC before) don´t show the histogram the same way the camera does.
Build-in features - WiFi connection and GPS should really be build in but in a way that Nikon Service can change those cards if technology changes.
Rubber - nice that we have a soft grip that feels good - i´d prefer to have one that sticks on the camera as well
Personally i don´t need more resolution and would be happy to see a "one does all"-D2-body based camera offering 8-10MP with further improvements - ergonomical and feature set - as stated above.
Nikonian from Vienna / Austria
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#13. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 12amitsharma Registered since 16th Jul 2004Thu 28-Jun-07 03:51 AM
I would like to have
Better Auto White Balance. Infact if its top of the line camera then it should have the best AWB technology can provide. I want my JPEGs to be great right out of the camera.
No noise upto ISO 2500.
Pixels schmixels, I dont care. FF is also not important to me.
Built in Wi-fi would be great.
Smaller focus points in the viewfinder for pin point focusing. But they shuld be similarly spread as with the D2X. I dont want them to stacked close. The focus points in the D2X are too large in my opinion.
Faster, better AF is mandatory in every new body. I dont even think that I have to mention it.
The flash sync terminal should be on the side, as it is in the D200. The caps covering it and the 10 pin remote should be like in the F6. I dont like to lose them every now and then.
If Nikon is taking its time to release the camera then they should test it thoroughly before they launch it. First batch problems are disgusting. The first batch buyers are often the brand loyalists. They deserve better.
I wont mind if they would release the S version first this time. It sucks how they launch the S version in a year with minor tweaks and make the other version look old in the second hand market.
Is it too much to expect a nice comfortable camera strap? I should not be required to buy a third party strap.
Should be cheaper than the Canon cameras.
#14. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
-- As much as I'd like to manually focus, my eyes are simply not as sharp as they used to be that I'd lose shots if I waited for my eyes to confirm good focus. I'd like a camera that allows me to compensate for lens focus problems as with the new Mk.III, but one step further -- would be nice to compensate for various points of the focal length of a zoom lens.
-- Or live preview as manual focus aid
-- More dynamic range please
-- Better high ISO noise performance
-- Color-calibrated LCD.
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#15. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 14osy79 Registered since 21st Jan 2003Thu 28-Jun-07 02:24 PM
Issue # 1 – Sensor
Full Frame - Large photosites/ Foveon "type" sensor / 18MP neighborhood.
ISO - I think 6400 is the new high ISO standard, but I need it to be like the MKIII.
Colors - Would like to see colors like the Fuji (no more harsh yellow).
Dynamic Range - The "option" to increase DR like Fuji by using the Func button (of course this effects speed).
Compressed RAW - I would like to see 50% and 25% compressed RAW (this should also increase our buffer).
DX Crop - Option for 1.5X crop, increases to 8 FPS, compatible with DX lenses, & 2nd generation "masking".
High Speed Crop - Option for 2X crop, increases to 10 FPS, compatible with DX lenses, & 2nd generation "masking".
White Balance - AWB that is more dedicated to mixed lighting, and skin tones. Something I can never have to worry about changing.
Infrared - This is a long shot, but can we press a "button" to remove the UV filter, and get IR shots? I'm talking on the fly here… yea, I'll keep dreaming.
Issue # 2 – Body
Rubber Grip - Have the rubber stop before it comes up to the front dial (so it never interferes again).
FUNC Button - Touch once to turn on, touch again to turn off with "indicator warning" in viewfinder (no more holding the button down to get FUNC to work).
Viewfinder - Using 2nd generation "mask" technology, have settings info "burned" transparently on the image in the viewfinder. Info can be turned on & off via control button, and info lights up in red (ie AF Sensors) to clearly see the changes as they are being made. Meter can remain on image but transparent for viewing and function, allowing the biggest & brightest viewfinder in Nikons history.
Caps - We need better caps for the PC & Sync connections. I always lose them on the first job.
C/S/M - Change this to a "stiffer" slide instead of a lever, with a longer throw so there's no question which function is engaged.
Memory Card - Dual CF slots for backup incorporating UDMA for faster buffer & preview.
AE / AF - Include AE/AF button on vertical grip.
“Default Settings” - Allow us to have "Default Settings" on the custom buttons. For example: if I hold down the WB button for 1 second it will switch to my "Default Setting" (which could be AWB, or 6500K or whatever I set it to), or pressing down the ISO for 1 second returns the ISO to 400. This would be very helpful for people who change settings on the fly and need to get back to their "default". These defaults could also be changed on demand, like the custom WB feature (but faster & easier).
LCD – 3’
Hotshoe - Screws on top please, so we don't have to send it to Nikon for a simple repair.
Light - While I don't use the light very often, it seems like we could make the switch a bit smoother to turn the light on without so much force.
Playback - I would like to press the Play button 1X for full image playback, 2X for 50% playback, and 3X for 100% playback so I can check sharpness fast. Just tap the shutter button to turn the LCD off (instead of Play). Previous methods for zooming would still be in effect.
CAM 2500 - Improved AF when shooting into bright lights or sun, and smaller focusing points.
Spot Meter - 1% Spot Meter
CLS 2.0 - Nikon radio frequency transmitter, with controls in camera. 60ft range without antenna, 1600ft range with antenna. The RF is used to communicate iTTL settings from camera to the new SB-900 speedlights (shhhhh, that’s another post).
Naming Files - Allow us more than 3 letters for prefix
Auto-ISO - Have this feature accessible from the ISO button, not under menu settings.
Focus Adjustment - Allow "focus adjustment" as featured in the MKIII so we can make necessary corrections.
These are all the things I can think of that I deal with. I know 18MP is huge, but you don’t have to shoot that high, you can shoot at 50% compressed RAW and your immediately at a reasonable size. Plus if FF isn’t your thing, you have the DX crop available (and again this helps on file size). The thing that really makes this design so intuitive are not the features that “match the MKIII”, but the little things, like improvement to the FUNC button, “default settings”, fast zoom on playback, etc. Things we already have today, but could assist our use substantially with some “tweaks”.
#20. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 15jbloom Nikonian since 15th Jul 2004Fri 29-Jun-07 08:38 AM
>Playback - I would like to press the Play button 1X for full
>image playback, 2X for 50% playback, and 3X for 100%
>playback so I can check sharpness fast. Just tap the shutter
>button to turn the LCD off (instead of Play). Previous
>methods for zooming would still be in effect.
How about a touch-screen LCD where you just touch the center with your finger and drag outward to zoom in, opposite motion to zoom out. That would be much more convenient than the current system.
Wethersfield, CT, USA
Connecticut High School Sports Photos
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#16. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
I'll ignore all the "normal" things like DR, pixel count, sensor size etc as these have been well covered.
One feature that I would find very useful is a "delete burst" option. I take quite a lot of sports pictures - cricket at the moment. Picture the scene... D2x, 200-400 on a Sidekick; frame nicely on batsman, bowler runs in and, just as the ball is delivered press the shutter. A couple of seconds later there might be one great shot, but (more frequently) absolutely nothing worth keeping. I shot a game last week, and shot useless bursts for five balls and didn't bother on the final ball of the over. Obviously it took the middle stump right out and would have made a great picture. Even with HSC, RAW files fill a 4GB card quite quickly without really irritating chimping.
Or - if we are being really radical - how about a "save burst" feature? In the typical scenario of shooting sports, a burst will normally be held in buffer memory, and only written to the memory card if actively requested (this would be a custom set-up function, default being to write everything to the card)
PS Oh yes - and built-in WiFi
#17. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
I've already commented on the D3. However, it dawned on me that this thread comes a bit late in Nikon's development cycle to have an effect on the features of the D3 - so we're more likely giving Nikon a wish list about the D4 and beyond. Hopefully, the D3 will have some of the more popular items desired.
By the way, I'm really intrigued by the eliminate/save burst idea.
#18. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
A couple things that havent been mentioned:
- In terms of higher dynamic range, how about a digital shutter of some sort? That is, the physical shutter stays open but the sensor records time-series of exposure that can be combined as desired later? So rather than combining several images as HDR now, one could choose the shutter speed after the fact on the time series from each photosite, or even various pieces of shutter speed? Does that make sense?
- A really simple thing that's hopefully not too late for a D3 is to turn the camera off in between frames of interval shooting. Right now even the healthy battery system of the D2xs is too quickly drained for no good reason while on interval shooting for timelapse applications. Maybe this can be addressed by firmware updates on the D2xs?
- I'd like to see a more customizeable bracketing -- why not have the control to pick exactly which brackets you want, rather than acquiring 9 frames just for the 3 you are interested in? Again, perhaps a firmwave update?
- I'd also like to see a more customizeable user screens, so I can pick what information is most useful to me within the viewfinder and not get distracted by other stuff.
- I really like the ability of SLR-like cameras that have a screen that rotates and let you compose. Why combine these two approaches, even if it requires a second sensor? I mean, an entire point and shoot camera costs $50 now, so how much could just the sensor cost? Just put the additional sensor directly into the viewfinder mirror channel and reroute the output to the display, and then allow the display to swivel out. I'd also like to have a sunshade for the viewfinder that blocks sun from any angle and orientation, or a brighter screen option for direct sun viewing.
- I'm new to Nikon and DSLR photography, but I was quite disappointed by the manuals that came with the D2xs and the lenses I bought. For $5000, I expect comprehensive information on how the sensor works, etc, such as can be found in Thom Hogans ebook. They should either team up with Thom Hogan or write their own manual that describes how these things actually work and what their engineers were thinking when they made it that way. I mean, there is such a robust and loyal Nikon community, why do they make everyone guess so much and have to reverse engineer answers? As an extremely simple example, would it be that much extra work for them to list the horizontal and vertical fields of view for the 10.5mm lens or DOF curves for the 18-200mm on the sheet that comes with it (or better yet on the lens barrel)? Wouldnt it benefit them and us to get answers to all of these questions direct from the horse's mouth?
#19. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 0
A couple more thoughts:
- simple internal bluetooth connection to an external viewfinder, which also had a hard drive for downloading CF cards
- improved metering method: this may not work, but my idea is to 1) take a picture in full program mode, so that the camera knows exactly what it metered and compared to for the exposure it picked, 2) user zooms in to the pixels of interest and 'places' the exposure (eg, the user zooms into white pixels that he/she still wants texture and says this should be 1.5 stops above meter gray), and 3) press a button to lock exposure settings given the placement and take the picture again. The idea here is that the meter resolution is never ever going to be as good as the picture resolution, so why not use the picture itself as a meter, like we essentially do anyway? By using a fully Program shot as the base, I think the CPU has all the information its needs to convert our selection into actual exposure settings. But maybe I'm missing something.
- Similar to this, rather than just a histogram of an image, why not a contour map of exposure values? Or the image rendered in patches of equal exposure value with user selectable colormappings to represent them? And/or a slider on the histogram that highlights those pixels on the image that I have highlighted in the histogram? And/or have the histogram adjust to the image within the zoom extent of the viewfinder? This is almost happening already, so it seems like its a pretty small step to a midtone flashing rather than just blown highlights.
Anyway, I guess I'm just thinking about the methods I use to try to figure out the settings on my own and have the CPU assist with that directly, but I'm still in the advanced amateur stage so I need all the help I can get.
#25. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 24dj dunzie Registered since 06th Sep 2006Tue 10-Jul-07 11:55 AM
Personally, I'd like to see them maintain a separate "H" and "X" model of the new pro body, and here's why... there is no single body that is going to offer exactly what ALL pro shooters want and still be remotely affordable. Sports shooters care less about a 16mp file and more about speed, accuracy and easier files, and the 1.5x crop was a real advantage on telephoto reach and affordability. Landscape pros will want that 16mp image - maybe a FF one - and care less about speed. It goes on and on. Having the X and H models afforded you the choice of which camera suited you better, and as a result sports shooters weren't paying for that 16mp sensor.
Personally, I'd be all over a new H model... and here's the improvements I'd love to see...
- 8-10mp image, tops
- I guess 12fps would be cool, but I gotta be honest, the 8 I get from the D2h is plenty fast
- Even better AF performance - not sure how, but I mean progress is progress right?
- Top notch ISO1600 performance, pretty good ISO3200 performance, and heck - usable ISO6400 performance
- ISO100 and even ISO50? Well, at least ISO100
The D2H, in my opinion, is an awesome sports machine, with two drawbacks. The 4mp file is limiting, I don't care who you are. It'd be great to double that and give you some crop flexibility. And secondly, the ISO1600 performance, while usable, isn't state of the art. ISO1600 and even ISO3200 being capable of producing clean images would really enhance shooting indoor sports.
Just make those two things happen in the new body, and I'll be writing a cheque.
Sigma EX 12-24/150
#27. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 26Tue 10-Jul-07 03:07 PM
A tiny modification I'd like to see is a place to screw the cap taken off the body on whatever screw-in cable is going into it, so they are not so easy to loose.
#28. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 27briantilley Nikonian since 26th Jan 2003Tue 10-Jul-07 03:21 PM
>A tiny modification I'd like to see is a place to screw the
>cap taken off the body on whatever screw-in cable is going
>into it, so they are not so easy to loose.
It doesn't screw in, but the existing D2 series already has small receptacles for both these little caps on the inside of the AV OUT / DC IN compartment door
#30. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 28Tue 10-Jul-07 03:49 PM
That's amazing! I've had the D2x for two years and lost several caps, without ever knowing about this secret storage area. Thanks for the tip.
#31. "RE: What changes you'd like on the D3 !?" | In response to Reply # 30Digital Skunk Registered since 09th Aug 2006Tue 10-Jul-07 09:30 PM
Hmmm What I want on the D3.
- 12MP at 8fps
- Dynamic range
- Same body as D2 with bigger AF selector button
- Yes... I want a 3" LCD screen, Sony had them in the Mavica's and in their consumer lineup a long time ago, that's when I fell in love with them
- Yes... bigger brighter viewfinder
- built in WiFI/GPS/Ethernet
- CF and SDHC slots (sorry... like the Canon)
- A func button that does a few more things... like display highlights in viewfinder/histogram
- Built in CLS sensor
- WICKED FAST AUTOFOCUS with GREAT LOCKON AND TRACKING
- Transfer files to external hard disk drive via USB
Just to name a few...