I can't afford a 400mm 2.8s nikkor just yet so I'm wondering about the reflex 500mm nikkor.I have heard about donuts etc. Just like to hear from experienced users.Any info ?
#1. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 0bgs Charter MemberThu 11-May-00 08:32 AM
As you can see, I took the freedom to move your topic to the Nikkor forum. Including more specific info in the subject may not be a bad idea for future postings
I don't have the Nikkor reflex 500, but it's dumped on the used market for really low prices. I do not think you really want this kind of lens if you're looking into the great, long Nikkor primes, such as the 400/2.8 and up.
Any Nikonian around here using the 500?
Bo (Nikonian in the Black Forest/Germany)
Bo Stahlbrandt - Founder & Administrator. I am mainly located in Bratislava, Slovakia.
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#9. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 1sven Basic MemberSat 03-Jun-00 09:13 PM
hi appy, bo and all the rest of you,
i'm using an AF-I 300/2,8 and an AF-S 500/4 sometimes with a TC14-E. The difference in focussing speed between r´the AF-I and teh AF-S is not so high. The AF-I 500/4 would be my choice for an used long AF lens with good quality/price ratio.
sven (nikonian from the lake of constance)
#10. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 9bgs Charter MemberMon 05-Jun-00 01:11 PM
welcome to Nikonians!
Could you give us a "ballpark figure" for what a used AF-I 500/4 might cost?
Bo (Nikonian in the Black Forest/Germany)
Bo Stahlbrandt - Founder & Administrator. I am mainly located in Bratislava, Slovakia.
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#13. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 1basilides Basic MemberMon 17-Jul-00 09:40 PM
I have the RF-Nikkor 500. I like it.
However; it is not the lens you want to bring out for taking bird pictures... or pictures of anything that moves for that matter
I have used it for landscapes (!), for shooting baloons from the distance, for star images (the Pleiades fit nicely in the field!), for roof-top city views and you can probably find a lot more situations where this lens is usefull.
- light. carried around easily.
- sharp. The doughnuts arise from the out-of-focus part
of the image, which can be a substantial fraction
since the DOF is very narrow. Think of it as a nice
effect, that you can exploit creatively!
- slow. f8... use it on a tripod.
- fixed aperture - no playing around with DOF.
In short; a fun lens for things that you might not think about using a 'normal' telelens for.
Thomas Heissel Dall,
astronomer and photographer
#2. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 0
#3. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 0
I have not used the Nikkor reflex but do have a tamron 500 reflex that has never given me any problems.
The picture quality is good and with a 2X teleconverter I can get deeper into the image than I need most times. The reflex design is proven and workable for most applications but as in my tamron the fixed apperture (f8 in my case) can limit the situations where a reflex is usable.
#4. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 0
I'd love to have a 400 f/2.8, but like you, I can't justify that expense. I waited patiently until I found a Nikkor 400 f/3.5 for less than $1500. If you read the reviews, some say it is the sharpest super-tele Nikon ever made. Whatever it is, I love mine and it produces awesome pics. With a TC-300 converter, it makes for an 800 f/7, too. Is that within you budget, and have you thought about that as an option?
#5. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 4
Thanks for the tip. I haven,t ever seen a 400mm f3.5 for sale here in Japan.I really want AF because I do action sports/races for a magazine and the speed and ease really pay of. However I still don't make enough to justify 8K for the 400/2.8 . Would you mind telling me where you bought it? Or a good dealer who has lots of long glass. For that price I'll manual foccus and bide my time till I can afford it.................................APPY
#6. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 5Mo Basic MemberSun 21-May-00 12:12 PM
Maybe it's just me but I actually like pictures taken with mirror lenses though they are rather limiting with only one focal length. They always appear to give very good colour rendition, in fact better than glass, I think it's the fact that mirror lenses do not suffer any chromatic aberration of any kind that helps it produce clean smooth pictures. Just my take on things.
#16. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 6
Just some words from me also.
There is no comparison b2in a CAT-lens(500 mirror) and a refractor type lens. Although a CAT-lens , usually of the maksutov type ( not using aspherical elements which are difficult to produse for such lenses , but miniscus correction filter) is a very well designed CAT , the obstruction in the center of the "lens" reduses contrast. I agree that the colour abberation is minimal due to the fact that the lens uses reflection and not refraction, but if you want to compare then .. Save money and get a Refractor.
Just my thoughts
All manual Anemos
#8. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 5Thu 25-May-00 02:31 AM
The lens I bought was posted for sale in the Nikon Digest. They are commonly available on ebay, but not normally for such a reasonable price. You mentioned AF, and like another poster pointed out, this lens works extremely well with the TC-16A. I use that combinatation on both my F4 and F5, and it works great. On my F5 it's fantastic. The AF speed is great. I use it to shoot NASCAR racing and I have not been disappointed. Feel free to ask more about this.
#14. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 8Mon 21-Aug-00 04:20 PM
I noticed that you are using a tc-16a teleconverter. I hope you don't mind me asking a question.
I recently bought an F4 with some lenses and a tc-16a. However, the camera won't meter through the lens with the teleconverter attached. Does this make any sense to you?
Thanks for your consideration.
#15. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 14Tue 22-Aug-00 09:39 AM
The short answer is: No, it doesn't make sense.
I have an F4, and I've used my TC-16A on it without problems. I usually use the TC-16A on my F5, since the AF sensitivity and speed are so much better than the F4. I can't remember if the F4 will still permit Matrix metering with the TC-16A. I'll go home tonight and try it with a couple different lenses.
Are you getting NO metering response at all? That is really odd. What lenses have you tried with the TC? Are you sure the F4 is working 100%? What are you seeing in the finder when you attach the TC and any given lens? I'm no expert, but if you can provide some more details of the problem we might be able to figure this out. I'm curious now.
I'm interested to hear more about this (and try to get it fixed)
#17. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 14Thu 24-Aug-00 01:40 PM
Victor- Thanks for the quick reply.
I just bought the F4 last week, along with four other lenses and the TC-16a. I've tried it with the 80-200 f2.8 zoom, a 55 micro, and a 300 f4. It does meter, but the readings are way off. For example, If the exposure with the 300mm lens is 1/500th at f11, when I add the TC-16a, it meters at 1/6 sec, and I think the f-stop didn't readout at all. I'll check it tonight if I can and get a more definitive answer. The F4 seems to be working fine, except for the autorewind not working. I'll try the TC on one of my 8008s's, now that you've told me it should meter. It kind of threw me when I read that it was primarily designed to add autofocus capability to MF lenses, so I thought it might not meter at all.
Thanks again for the reply-I'll be in touch.
#18. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 17Thu 24-Aug-00 01:59 PM
It definitely sounds like your F4 has some problems with the metering.
Try this too:
The F4's centerweighted and matrix meters get their reading from cells in the _prism_. The spot meter gets its reading from a cell in the _body_ . If I were you, I'd put a lens on, point at a scene, and switch among the three metering modes and see if there is agreement. Given the matrix mode's design function, I'd start out with a zero-contrast scene (like a blank wall) so scene contrast doesn't make the matrix meter try to apply its correction algorithms.
If the CW and Matrix agree, but together disagree with the spot meter, the problem might be isolated to the prism. If they are all out of whack, well...I don't know what to say.
Please keep us posted. I'm willing to use my equipment to duplicate any tests you want to validate.
#19. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 18Fri 25-Aug-00 04:54 PM
Thanks for your concern and your kind offer of assistance.
First, I want to apologize for not being more familar with the F4.
I am just getting back into photography after a looong layoff. I
recently purchased a pair of 8008s', so most of the labels on the
F4 controls are familiar, but I am still having problems with some of them. I have ordered a manual from Craig Camera, so that should solve most of those types of problems.
I performed the meter tests as you suggested. I noticed that my TC-16a has no pins to read the lens parameters on the lens side of its mount.
Is this typical, or do I have an early version? This seems to be the reason that it's not getting any aperture info from the lens. (That's a no-brainer.)
Anyway, it meters fine using a gray card that fills the frame in spot, cw, and matrix modes(i.e., no change in switching between modes)with a standard lens without the TC. In manual mode, it was metering at 1/15th sec at f8.
With the TC in manual mode, it metered at about 1/8 sec at f9.5, or 1.5 stops down, which is what you would expect. However, when I switched to shutter preferred, the display read 1.5 sec @ A, and changing the shutter speed dial didn't change the shutter speed in the display. Same readout for P and PH metering.
Aperture preferred metering seemed to be working fine, metering at the equivalent settings to manual mode.
The MB-23 back displays shutter speed, not aperture.
All the above seems consistent if the TC-16a can't read the lens
aperture info, EXCEPT for the inability to adjust shutter speeds
in shutter preferred mode.
Any 'light' you can shed on the above would be most appreciated.
#20. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 19Fri 25-Aug-00 07:48 PM
>Thanks for your concern and your
>kind offer of assistance.
No problem. I like to help.
>ordered a manual from Craig
>Camera, so that should solve
>most of those types of
The F4 is very straightforward. The manual will help, but you won't find many surprises. What you do need is a manual for the MF-23, if you don't have one. Its operation is NOT intuitive in any way.
>I performed the meter tests as
>you suggested. I noticed that
>my TC-16a has no pins
>to read the lens parameters
>on the lens side of
It SHOULD have one little tab on the outer circumference near the "N" where "Nikon" is silkscreened on the outer surface. Using the clock-face coordinates, it's around 1 or 2 o'clock. It's small--look closely. There are two more inside my converters, right next to the glass elements. They are important, but the one on the outside conveys the aperture setting of the lens. It's very important.
>Is this typical, or do I
>have an early version?
As far as I know they are all the same.
>seems to be the reason
>that it's not getting any
>aperture info from the lens.
Here's an important fact that will clear up a lot:
The F4 doesn't work in S, P, or Ph mode with the TC-16A. You won't get an aperture readout in the viewfinder LCD or on the MF-23.
The manual for the F4 has a compatibility matrix in it (I'm looking at mine right now) that will show you exactly what does and doesn't work with what. I could try to paraphrase it, but it will be far easier for you to study it when your manual arrives. (It's on page 86 of my manual)
>Aperture preferred metering seemed to be
>working fine, metering at the
>equivalent settings to manual mode.
>The MB-23 back displays shutter speed,
And it won't ever display an aperture with the TC-16A attached.
>All the above seems consistent if
>the TC-16a can't read the
>aperture info, EXCEPT for the inability
>to adjust shutter speeds
>in shutter preferred mode.
When you try to set S, P, or Ph mode, the camera just sets itself to A mode. That's why you percieve a problem. In reality, it's doing what it's supposed to.
The only thing I see potentially wrong here is you observation about the lack of an aperture following tab on the TC. I suspect if you look closely you'll find it.
Let me know if this isn't clear, or if you have any more questions. It sounds like we're getting this straightened out.
#21. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 20Thu 31-Aug-00 01:36 PM
Hi-thanks for the email, and sorry it took me so long to reply.
My internet access is at work, and when I'm busy, the personal stuff has to slip.
My TC-16a seems to have all the tabs that you mentioned, and according to your comments I think all is as it should be. I just got my F4 manual (and yes I also bought one for the sb-23 back), so now I understand the function of the last few levers and buttons I couldn't figure out.
Thanks again for the help. This site is a wonderful resource! I'm very glad I found y'all!
What sorts of photography are you interested in? I've been doing some hiking at our state and county parks, and carrying along too much gear, as I suppose most photographers do. I'm also in the process of setting up my old B&W darkroom, which I haven't used in almost 20 years. So, lots to do here.
#22. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 21Sat 02-Sep-00 06:31 PM
>and according to your comments
>I think all is as
>it should be.
Great! Now have fun with your new stuff.
>What sorts of photography are you
I travel a great deal in the line of my work, so I've always got a camera with me on a trip, and I seek out photo ops like parks, and regional scenery, museums, whatever.
I love to shoot all forms of motorsports. CART, NASCAR, M/X, Drag racing, vintage, you name it. I'm going to the USGP in Indy later this month. Someday I'll put up a page with some of my favorite shots.
#11. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 5
I have a MF Tokina 300mm f2.8 for sale if you're interested APPY, it's in mint condition (90%) with all accessories 'cause I hardly use it. It may work with TC-16A but I can't confirm that.
Photodo gives this lens a rating of 4, and it's AF counterparts 3.7 to 3.9.
Let me know if you're keen.
#7. "RE: need help with long glass........" | In response to Reply # 4
You need AF but can't afford the big AF lenses. You are not alone. I also recommend the 400/3.5. I was lucky to find a used one for $1100 (ugly from the outside but sharp as can be) and, boy, it has been great.
One feature not well known about this lens is that it can be used with the discontinued TC-16A teleconverter. This converter was made for the 1st AF bodies from Nikon and allowed using AF with manual lenses. It was only recommended for <200mm lenses but I found out that it works very well with the AF300/4 and 400/3.5 (w/ occasional minor vignetting). It won't allow full AF functions but works very well after some practice. First you need to manually prefocus within your subject range, then the TC-16A will do the final focus adjustment. It is very quick as the TC-16A is a tiny unit. The AF300/4 has a faster AF with the converter than without.
Moneywise the TC-16A can be found between $70 and $120. Think about it, that makes an AF640/5.6 for around $1200... Not bad.
Your other options are to wait for the 80-400VR ($1800), or get a Sigma AF500/4.5 ($3200). I do not think the 500/8 will cut it for sports, first it's a MF lens, and second it's quite slow.
#12. "Long glass" | In response to Reply # 0
Anyone who praises the 400/3.5 EDIF Nikkor is right. I shoot hundreds of rolls a year through it, from daylight football action to features to baseball with the TC-14B aboard, and it has never disappointed me. It's incredibly easy to hit with it, since it's bright, very sharp, and in my case, very smooth to focus. I got mine used from Photo-Fax.com for a very decent price. The other side of that is that I also pack a 500/8 mirror in the trunk of my car for occasions when I am not expecting to need big glass, or even if I have a relatively light workload of sports. It's decent for action, but since it's relatively dark in the viewfinder, and since its depth of field is so slim, it's pretty easy to miss, especially for fast action. Still, if you hit, it will yield a good product. Also, always handhold it at a 500th or faster; it won't tolerate a 250th.