Even though we ARE Nikon lovers,we are NOT affiliated with Nikon Corp. in any way.

English German French

Sign up Login
Home Forums Articles Galleries Recent Photos Contest Help Search News Workshops Shop Upgrade Membership Recommended
members
All members Wiki Contests Vouchers Apps Newsletter THE NIKONIAN™ Magazines Podcasts Fundraising

D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good

Ferguson

Cape Coral, US
5750 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author
Ferguson Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for the generous sharing of his high level expertise in the spirit of Nikonians Nikonian since 19th Aug 2004
Sun 25-Mar-12 03:28 AM

I have my new D800 but am travelling and my D300 is only from memmory, but I think there is a change in how auto-ISO works that frankly I do not like.

In (for example) "A" mode, auto-iso, in a dim room with the flash up, my recollection of the D300 is that it did the iTTL measurement and adjusted the ISO only if the flash was inadequate at full power. Did I make that up?

With the D800, the auto-ISO is setting the ISO based on ambient light, and appears to ignore the fact that the flash is going to fire. I've tried both spot meter (which forces BL off) and center. Basically everything came out at 6400 (which is where I had it set) even if the subject was at 2' away.

This means if shooting with a flash, auto-iso is pretty much useless unless you want it just for fill.

I don't have a separate flash to try.

Can anyone confirm? Is my recollection correct on the D300? How about others?

I keep thinking I am missing a setting somewhere, but the only way I have found to get the flash to provide the light instead of the ISO compensating is turn it off -- what I really want is for it to fill in only if the flash is not powerful enough.

I don't think it matters but trying this with a 24-70/2.8 Nikon lens.

Comments welcomed on pictures: Http://captivephotons.com

Marmion4

Near Sacramento, US
188 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#1. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 0

Marmion4 Gold Member Nikonian since 21st Sep 2008
Sun 25-Mar-12 03:14 AM

In one of the forums, the link for the manual was posted. Might try that.

Good luck & please post pic

Laura

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Ferguson

Cape Coral, US
5750 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#2. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 1

Ferguson Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for the generous sharing of his high level expertise in the spirit of Nikonians Nikonian since 19th Aug 2004
Sun 25-Mar-12 10:01 AM | edited Sun 25-Mar-12 10:08 AM by Ferguson

>In one of the forums, the link for the manual was posted.
>Might try that.

I've been reading the menual since the day it was posted, also the technical supplement they posted. Neither one speaks to the concern, as best I can see.

What I really need to do is get back where I have both the D300 and an external flash to check. I really liked the way my D300 worked, but 95% of the time I used it in that mode it was with an SB800, which has some real differences (notably you can turn of BL in center or matrix metering mode, something not possible in the D300 or D800 as best I can tell with the popup.

Here is what I am trying, tell me what you expect:

- Frame a close surface with no background, I used a bed spread at about 4'
- Set camera to manual (I used 1/90th and 2.8)
- Be sure it is dark enough that the base ISO is insufficient
- Set to spot metering (turning off BL, but same results with)
- Fire three shots at the same composition:
1) With auto-ISO, no flash
2) With auto-ISO, with flash
3) With no Auto-ISO, with flash

When I do this, case (1) and (2) are about the same ISO (in this case it went from 100 to 1500, but case (3) is at the base ISO.

More interestingly, case (2) and (3) are about the same exposure (both by eye and histogram). Clearly in case (3) it had ample flash power, and had actually REDUCED the flash power in case (2) and increased the ISO instead.

Which (in my opinion) is dead wrong. I want it (in non-BL mode) to always increase the flash to max before increasing the ISO. Which is what I Think the D300 did.

Are my expectations not right?

PS. I just found this discussion on the subject when the D300s came out.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1039&message=35622486

It appears similar. I tested commander mode (as mentioned) and it appears to simply turn auto-ISO off entirely for flash use, so that's not a good workaround.


Comments welcomed on pictures: Http://captivephotons.com

jpFoto

US
1114 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#3. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 0

jpFoto Registered since 25th Jun 2010
Sun 25-Mar-12 10:24 AM

I don't have the D800 yet, but I had experienced the same thing with a D3100, and never was able to find an explanation. I did some tests with both my D700 and the D3100, and the D700 did not act the same way, instead it appeared that the D700 anticipated the flash. So, my only work around is to turn Auto ISO off when using the built-in flash. I know that I did some tests using the SB900, but I can't recall whether or not the D3100 had the same problem, but the D700 did not have that problem. Also as I recall there was a thread in the D7000 forum complaining about the same or a similar problem.

jP



darthsir

US
52 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#4. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 0

darthsir Registered since 05th May 2011
Sun 25-Mar-12 09:29 PM

Nikon seemed to change the way it works on all the newer cameras. I experienced same going from D60 to D5100. D60 worked fine with flash and auto-ISO, but D5100 responds similar to D800 results.

I use auto-ISO (on D5100) for sports at max of 6400. Sometimes for huddle or between play shots, I use flash but must either drop auto-ISO or set its max to the exact value I want.

Most people just elect not to use auto-ISO with flash.

Dewey

Visit my Nikonians gallery.


http://www.dkmoon.zenfolio.com

Ferguson

Cape Coral, US
5750 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#5. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 4

Ferguson Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for the generous sharing of his high level expertise in the spirit of Nikonians Nikonian since 19th Aug 2004
Sun 25-Mar-12 09:31 PM

>Nikon seemed to change the way it works on all the newer
>cameras. I experienced same going from D60 to D5100. D60
>worked fine with flash and auto-ISO, but D5100 responds
>similar to D800 results.

Darn shame. It worked very nicely before. Some darn programmer who never takes photos "fixed" it maybe.


Comments welcomed on pictures: Http://captivephotons.com

rodantking

US
93 posts

Click to send email to this author Click to send private message to this author

#6. "RE: D800, Auto-ISO and built in flash - is this right? Not good" | In response to Reply # 5

rodantking Registered since 14th Feb 2012
Mon 26-Mar-12 12:42 PM | edited Mon 26-Mar-12 01:17 PM by rodantking

It's to bring in the background better. Frankly when I set a shot most of the time this is how I do it when not in auto. I'm glad they made the change. When I'm working fast, it's easier to get the opposite effect (not balanced backgrounds) in a hurry than it is to balance.
I would be much happier if they unlink exposer comp. with the flash (like cannon) so your exposer comp was just for back ground and your flash comp was for your subject.

G