New Nikon Z9 flagship?

I must admit I’m always a bit puzzled by suggestions that one camera company is ahead of another. There are so many technologies packed into a camera that no single brand or model can realistically be identified as the technology leader.

A friend was recently reentering photography after a several year absence and no remaining kit. She could start from a clean slate and has the technical expertise to want high-end equipment. We started making a list of “technologies” to evaluate - focus speed, focus lock, eye A-F, human and animal, low-light focus, dynamic range, native ISO, ISO range, noise versus ISO, light metering options and capabilities, inherent color tint in RAW images, the role of the camera in edge-to-edge sharpness versus focal length, mechanical robustness, weather sealing, ergonomics, weight, balance versus lens size and weight, EVF resolution, frame speed and burst length, memory card types, lenses available with or without what kind of adaptors, a million software questions. I could go on and on. I think our list had over 40 line items. The point is that no single camera company has the lead in every technology, and in the end we choose our cameras based on which of these features are most important to us. Then unless we have more money than God we need to stay on our chosen path.

Kevin

>Actually the high megapixel cameras are pretty good in low
>light. They benefit form downsizing to a common output size,
>and that almost completely offsets the advantage of larger
>photosites with lower resolution cameras...

Eric, can you explain this in more detail? I don't get it.

David-

I bought the 500mm which is not a Z lens, but with the adapter, fits just nicely. Most of the summer I ran around with that lens on my Z7, getting flowers, bees, dragonflies, etc. It was like $1,500. If they were to make the 400mm for the Z mount but made it a 2.8, the cost would have to be way higher, like $4,000 (my estimate).

"Today is the tomorrow that yesterday you spent money like there was no."

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

>
>If Nikon can get the reputation of being a leader in the
>mirrorless segment (both pro bodies & lenses) and sees the
>Jared Polin - like YouTubers praise Nikon mirrorless cameras
> rather than destroy them in comparison with Sony & Canon,
>like they have been doing), then the 'average' consumer will
>be more tempted to buy and stick with Nikon ... hence
>protecting my investment in Nikon lenses into the future

There is one solution to market perception and that is Nikon changing its marketing methods. No one who has used both Sony and Nikon would choose Sony for its serious weaknesses such as lacking weather sealing or build quality. They market on 1 trait exclusive, the apparent speed of tracking of AF by the little VF focus point box. Nikon lost points in that because the box moves less rapidly, but the indicator and actual focus are not that much in agreement.
But consumers have been trained to rank this category of product based on this one critiera, and not the focus of that actual capture.
Nikon, to survive has to understand the market and promotion has changed radically in the last 10 years. Now, the main influence are not ads which are expensive and not effective, but to social media influencers. A print ad campaign seen once can cost millions and have almost impact on sales. Yet a social media influencer can pan the competition with intentional bias and it crashes sales of that item. For example Ford spends more than any company on ads for their trucks, $3000 per truck sale, which is higher than the gross margin on building the truck and sales keep dropping,and they keep increasing their ad budget. The marketing department is old fashion and used to market behavior of the 1950s. Tesla spend nothing on ads, but social media influencers have made the only profitable auto company in the world during the pandemic and a market cap far bigger than GM, Ford, Mercedes combined. It was just added to the S&P 500 as the biggest market cap company ever to enter the index, larger than 98% of the companies already in the index.
It is driven by social media that defined the perception of the company and products. But they still do not spend money on ads, or even paying influencers butt they invite social media influencers to the table, cater to them, invite them to product unveils and earnings calls, so they are invested in the company as if they are insiders. They have more access to the company president than mainstream media or financial press.
In cameras, Sony was a late starter, a couple of time, they are on their 4th mount style, having abandoned all the prior customer investment several times. But being a media company, with movies, music, TV production etc. So they know promotion and determined early on that social media was the new marketing playing field. By seeking out influencers with high views and subscriptions and paying them instead of ad companies, sales exploded. Does anyone think these people, who are not photographers of any note, are investing hundreds of thousands a year to produce daily content just for the fun of it? Scriptwriters, editors, studios space, cameramen etc are expensive yet the high sub count channels on YouTube are VERY profitable.Their sources of income comes from Direct promotion contracts with manufacturers, YouTube ad revenue sharing, and affiliate links to major on-line retailers.Sony jumped on that early so channels which started by hobbyists and usually having and recommending Nikon, all switched to Sony at about the same time. At first the channels were about photography but when money was involved the focus was on a current model. High view channels earn Millions of dollars a year from ad revenue and direct payments. But that is a tiny fraction of the old print and broadcast ad budgets used in 1950s style promotion driven by big ad agencies.
You will notice that photograph awards and working professional photographers are still dominated by Nikon and Canon because both brands built cameras that fit the needs of that clientele. For years, and even more so now, the annual International Press Photography awards are dominated by Nikon shooters, with over half of all the awarded images were shot with Nikon. Sony was 2%. The reason is simple, those types of shooter are not hanging around consumer oriented social media taking advice from unpublished amateur photographers who only talk about AF eye tracking. They never talk about the features that are important to actual photographers such as build and handling. The simple reason those important traits are not talked about, and only Eye Af is that that is all they have as a promotional difference.
Nikon needs to fire their marketing department, whose members are surly over retirement age now and identify potential social media personalities and back them as they focus on all the points that separate Nikon from the pack. For example the once good build quality of Canon pro cameras has been abandoned with effort to the alternative to Sony. If you have shot with EOS R or R6, you will know they scimped on materials and the feel as flimsy as Sony's consumer grade materials. Talking to the local warranty station for Nikon, Canon Sony, Panasonic and Fuji they admit more quality issues with the newer Cannon than ever before and it was their suggestion that they were trying to cheapen the products because Sony established how low quality can be used and still sell a lot. They said they see only Panasonic and Nikon in the Fx realm that cares about build. After dealing with Sony and Panasonic for decades in the professional audio industry, the same Sony building to the price point over use case has always been there. Panasonic only sold well to real pros who did not pay attention to marketing. And it appears their S1 and SR1 cameras are suffering in sales in a market where true quality is not as important as a promotion by popular social media personalities.
Nikon could turn sales around very quickly by becoming more modern in promotion and getting out of their long print ad contracts that do nothing for sales. With this release of the Z6 2 however, they might be waking up a bit. Youtube channels who earned nothing from ad revenue sharing but featured professional photographers who just did videos on the side like Monohrome Memories or Matt Irwin, Taylor Jackon, Hudson Henry, Steve Perry and a few others, working pros who are articulate and thoughtful and had cameras sent to them this time ahead of general release. Nikon is paying attention to these smaller channels on YouTube, that is a start but they need to maybe develop some media personalities who are able to work full time with daily uploads and a production team. Spending a little on FB and Instagram ads to kick them off, they could make some media stars who could double sales in a year or less. The number of features and traits that the Z bodies have over the Canon and Sony is really impressive but the audience needs to be told and shown why IQ, handling, menu, build, connectivity, color science,EVF sharpness and S lens performance, and a lot more, are important.Even real focus tests of 3.0 firmware between the Z6 and a73 where the Youtuber praised how much faster and sure the focus point tracks in burst mode was surprised when showing all the actual frames, the Nikon had 50% more frames in focus on a person running towards the camera than the Sony had. I use my Z6 daily and almost never miss focus, even in dark dance clubs or jazz clubs. I will do entire 400-600 frame studio sessions for clothing ads or for play or concert promotions and not have one frame out of focus. It is a none issue for me.
Next time a friend brags about their new Sony and its focusing excellence, ask to see unedited photos, before they are cherry-picked. I have not found any feature or quality of the Nikon D850 or Z6 that is inferior to a Sony. Nikon has to inform people about that and the most effective way ever invented was YouTube. At least hire some 20-year-olds as marketing advisors.

Stan
St Petersburg Russia

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

I agree. There are some different designs for Z-mount that have a wider rear element. That provides for less vignetting and better edges. But as far as the flange distance is concerned, I don't think it matters for long lenses.

The Nikon telephoto lenses are designed to have a recessed rear element that allows the teleconverters to fit into the back end of the lens. The new Z teleconverters are designed in a similar manner. Since the teleconverters are already released the lens rear elements can't change very much.

So with that lens, one would likely have to use a tripod with the plate on the lens, instead of on the camera. For my 400, I use a wimberley head and gimbal. I'm not thinking of it as a hand holding lens.

Do you think I'm off on that?

"Today is the tomorrow that yesterday you spent money like there was no."

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

>I agree. The 400 f/2.8 is certainly a staple for sports
>photographers. If you are going to embrace the Z9 as
>described, that lens is required.

Sony did one as a mirrorless-only but had nothing to lose, with no DSLR base.

Nikon has a good 400/2.8 that with an adapter works with the mirrorless; if they build a Z version it cannot be used with the DSLR. And that's a pretty big commitment given how few they sell (compared to something like a 24-70 or 70-200).

Cannon will make that commitment I think because their volume is higher, especially in the sports world.

Will Nikon really make that big of a commitment to the mirrorless world, after their wimpy commitment so far, by doing a mirrorless-only 400/2.8.

Will sports photographers who want the Z9 really not buy it because of needing to use a F version (which they likely already have)?

Linwood

PS. Frankly I'm surprised no one is doing long lenses with replaceable mounts, sort of an adapter but more built in. Kind of like they did for CF/XQD when they wouldn't make a commitment. Kind of like "Honey, will you Marry me, but do you mind if I keep dating your sister" type commitment to XQD.


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>Anyways, we will know
>Nikon's plan when they want us to know it.

Nikon appreciates the presumption they have a plan.

Linwood

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