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Subject: "Focus and Recompose.." Previous topic | Next topic
jmbw Registered since 28th Mar 2011Thu 07-Apr-11 07:22 PM
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"Focus and Recompose.."


US
          

Hi, I just got a D7000 and have had a bit of trouble getting perfectly focused shots everytime. I have set up the camera to show me the selected focus point ( once the shot is completed) to try and see what was going on- though even when it looks like the focus point selected is on correct part of subject it still doesnt look sharp ( sometimes.. not always).
My question is.. when I use the single focus point to focus on subject and then recompose shot - the focus point location on the subject it shows as being used ( when checking data after shot) isnt the actual part of the subject I focused on - it is where the focus point I selected ended up being after I recomposed. Is that correct? So consequently.. it wont be able to tell me what part of the subject I focus on ( when using the focus and recompose method of shooting)?

Just want to make sure I'm understanding how it works

  

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Subject Author Message Date ID
Reply message RE: Focus and Recompose..
igordb Silver Member
07th Apr 2011
1
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JohnE Nikon Silver Member
07th Apr 2011
2
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Gamecocks Silver Member
07th Apr 2011
3
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chroaz Gold Member
08th Apr 2011
5
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jmiguez Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
6
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briantilley Moderator
10th Apr 2011
7
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jmiguez Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
9
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paul_7e Silver Member
22nd Apr 2011
14
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Gamecocks Silver Member
22nd Apr 2011
15
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paul_7e Silver Member
22nd Apr 2011
16
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BillboTex
25th Apr 2011
22
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JohnE Nikon Silver Member
25th Apr 2011
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carpemoment
25th Apr 2011
25
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JohnE Nikon Silver Member
25th Apr 2011
26
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kuzzy Silver Member
07th Apr 2011
4
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billD80 Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
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elec164 Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
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jmiguez Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
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briantilley Moderator
10th Apr 2011
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TakeTwo Silver Member
24th Apr 2011
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elec164 Silver Member
10th Apr 2011
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carpemoment
23rd Apr 2011
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four eighty sparky Silver Member
23rd Apr 2011
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24th Apr 2011
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igordb Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Dec 2010Thu 07-Apr-11 07:40 PM
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#1. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 0


CA
          

I have the same experience. What I do sometimes, I do not recompose. I make composition and just choose different focus sensor that points to an object you want to be in focus.
Igor

  

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JohnE Nikon Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jun 2010Thu 07-Apr-11 07:51 PM
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#2. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 0
Thu 07-Apr-11 07:52 PM by JohnE Nikon

New HArtford, US
          

You are correct the camera does not know where you originally focused when using focus and recompose. So when viewing later the focus bracket is not accurately reflecting what you focused on.

When dealing with shallow depth of field like with a wide open aperture and shooting close to subject you may have a focus plane behind your intended subject with focus and recompose method. consider trying Igor's method in this situation.

See below.
http://visual-vacations.com/Photography/focus-recompose_sucks.htm

http://improvephotography.com/216/photography-focus-recompose-compose-portrait/

Also check out this forum post
http://www.nikonians.org/forums/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=329&topic_id=6812

JohnE Nikon
https://plus.google.com/photos/104310967428146619677/albums?hl=en

https://picasaweb.google.com/104310967428146619677


"Cameras and lenses are simply tools to place our unique vision on film. Concentrate on equipment and you'll take technically good photographs. Concentrate on seeing the light's magic colors and your images will stir the soul." Jack Dykinga

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Gamecocks Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Jul 2010Thu 07-Apr-11 08:53 PM
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#3. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 0


Joanna, US
          

From Thom Hogan on "focus and reframe": set custom setting #F5 to AF-ON, set focus mode to AF C; now your camera is configured to autofocus ONLY when you press the AE-L/AF-L button and this allows you to focus and reframe. Focus on the subject using the button, let go of the button, then reframe. Focus stays where it was when you let go of the AE-L/AF-L button.

John

Nobody should seek his own good, but the good of others. <><

  

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chroaz Gold Member Nikonian since 26th Apr 2009Fri 08-Apr-11 12:40 AM
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#5. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 3


Cave Creek, US
          

I agree with John. I use the "back button focus" technique almost exclusively.

Chris

When words become unclear, I shall focus with photographs. When images become inadequate, I shall be content with silence.
- Ansel Adams

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

www.throughmeyelens.com

  

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jmiguez Silver Member Nikonian since 17th Oct 2010Sun 10-Apr-11 02:08 AM
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#6. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 5


Lafayette, US
          

I do too. Be aware of a "gotcha"

It seems to me that the auto-focus must be active to move the focus box. I often find that I can't move it until I press the shutter slightly. This can be discombobulating in the heat of the moment.

If I am incorrect in my assumption and the issue is more to do with the loose nut behind the camera than the auto-focus, please set me straight.

John

My Pictures may be seen here: http://jmiguez.smugmug.com/

  

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briantilley Moderator Deep knowledge of bodies and lens; high level photography skills Nikonian since 26th Jan 2003Sun 10-Apr-11 10:12 AM
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#7. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 6


Paignton, GB
          

>It seems to me that the auto-focus must be active to move the
>focus box.

Almost, but not quite...

In fact, it is the viewfinder displays that must be active before the AF Point can be moved. The viewfinder display is turned on by half-pressing the shutter release or by pressing the AE-L/AF-L button (if you have AF activation set up that way). You can then release whichever button you pressed, and the AF Point can still be moved until the camera meter times-out and the displays go dark.

Brian
Welsh Nikonian

  

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jmiguez Silver Member Nikonian since 17th Oct 2010Sun 10-Apr-11 01:57 PM
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#9. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 7
Sun 10-Apr-11 01:58 PM by jmiguez

Lafayette, US
          

>>It seems to me that the auto-focus must be active to move
>the
>>focus box.
>
>Almost, but not quite...
>
>In fact, it is the viewfinder displays that must be active
>before the AF Point can be moved...
>
>Brian

Thanks for educating me Brian. I was correct in the spirit , if not the letter. I mentioned it for any other newbies. It took me a while and a few lost shots to figure out why the focus box wouldn't move.

John

My Pictures may be seen here: http://jmiguez.smugmug.com/

  

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paul_7e Silver Member Charter MemberFri 22-Apr-11 02:54 PM
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#14. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 3


US
          

I saw this in the Thom Hogan CD, and I have been using the AE-L/AF-L button for focus on my D7K as well as my D90. However, on the D7K for "focus and reframe", when I let go of the button, the focus indicator (green dot) on the left bottom of the view finder screen disappears. Is this normal and does the camera still maintain focus? Also, the focus indicator also displays when I press the shutter release button part-way on both cameras. Any ideas what is going on?
Thanks

  

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Gamecocks Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Jul 2010Fri 22-Apr-11 05:12 PM
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#15. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 14


Joanna, US
          

Once you remove your finger from the button the green dot will go off and the focus will still be maintained unless you move the subject outside the focus bracket in the viewfinder; I find that if outside the bracket it does not release the shutter as it is not in focus (unless you have it set for "release priority"). When the AE-L/AF-L button is used for focus and, instead, I use the shutter button I get a green arrow but not the dot; subject not in focus. Hope this helps.

John

Nobody should seek his own good, but the good of others. <><

  

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paul_7e Silver Member Charter MemberFri 22-Apr-11 07:13 PM
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#16. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 15


US
          

Thanks, John. You answered my question about maintaining focus after the green dot disappears. Sometimes, the green dot appears and sometimes just arrows when I use the shutter button instead of the AE-L/AF-L button, but it's not consistent, and as long as focus is maintained with the AE-L/AF-L button released, it's OK.
Paul

  

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BillboTex Registered since 23rd Nov 2010Mon 25-Apr-11 02:00 PM
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#22. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 3


Houston, US
          

>set custom setting #F5 to AF-ON

DONE

>set focus mode to AF C

Now for the dumb question. Where do I go (menu) to set the focus mode to AF C?

.
.
.

MY SETUP
Nikon D7000 with zoomNIKKOR AF-S DX 10-24mm f3.5,
Tamron AF 18-270mm Macro f3.5 Di II VC LD
and Tamron AF 180mm f/3.5 Di SP A/M FEC LD (IF) 1:1 Macro
Nikon R1 Wireless Close-Up Speedlight System,
ZacutoEVF Pro
Two SanDisk 32GB EXTREME PRO SDHC-UHS-1 (45MB/S)
viewNX2 captureNX2 NIKCompleteCollection Ultimate
Photo Mechanic 4.6.6 Annotate Pro
Vegas Movio Studio 10 Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 14

  

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JohnE Nikon Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jun 2010Mon 25-Apr-11 03:06 PM
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#24. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 22
Mon 25-Apr-11 03:11 PM by JohnE Nikon

New HArtford, US
          

>>set custom setting #F5 to AF-ON
>
>DONE
>
>>set focus mode to AF C
>
>Now for the dumb question. Where do I go (menu) to set the
>focus mode to AF C?

There is a button which you must depress adjacent to to the lens attachment lower front right of camera, where the manual and auto focus switch is. While depressed spin the rear command dial which will change from AF-C / AF-A, and AF-S modes. The front command dial switches from single focus to multiple focus brackets. Button needs to be depressed when turning these command dials.

A few months ago I started shooting with AF-ON button and really liked it. To avoid focus plane errors with focus and recompose method I will now often move focus points around. About 2 weeks ago I switched back to focusing with shutter release button as I found it hard to move focus points around with the same thumb I use for focusing.
So far my conclusions are the benefits of moving focus point around and not using AF-ON are

-When subject is near edge of frame especially with a wider angle lens and with small apertures and narrow DOF you can nail the focus. (lately I have been experimenting creatively with narrow DOF's and find this important)
-You can now hand your camera off to someone to take a snapshot of you without having to go into a 5 minute explanation on how to focus or switching AF-ON back to off
- You are more likely to remember to hold down shutter for .5 sec to engage VR
- In low light light I like to use light assist mode for my external flash which has an infrared assist. I also sometimes like to use camera's focus light assist mode. This only works with center focus in AF-S mode. With AF-ON you are never in AF-S mode.


The disadvantages

-I have found that moving focus points around is slower for me (may change with time) than with focus and recompose and AF-On
-Sometimes it is hard to see the active focus bracket especially when there is a high tonal variance in frame. I often have to first hit center button to get focus in middle and then move it to where I want it.
- I now have to switch from AF-C to AF-S. (I have gotten pretty good at this, and can accomplish quickly while looking through viewfinder.
- With focus and recompose I mainly used center focus which has both horizontal and vertical focusing components and can grab focus better than focus bracket near edge.

I just got back from a vacation last week and shot slightly more than 2500 shots. I think overall I had more tack sharp images then with AF-ON although there were a handful, aprox 10 where I focused on something other than my intended subject. I attribute this to my error and the difficulty I have with seeing active focus bracket and moving to desired location quickly. I am not sure if my success is due to not using focus and recompose but rather an overall improvement in technique. The reasons why focus and recompose may not work is outlined in the 2 links in my original reply to this post.

JohnE Nikon
https://plus.google.com/photos/104310967428146619677/albums?hl=en

https://picasaweb.google.com/104310967428146619677


"Cameras and lenses are simply tools to place our unique vision on film. Concentrate on equipment and you'll take technically good photographs. Concentrate on seeing the light's magic colors and your images will stir the soul." Jack Dykinga

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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carpemoment Registered since 17th Dec 2009Mon 25-Apr-11 03:44 PM
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#25. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 24


Raleigh, US
          

Moving the AF point around is awkward at first but I used that method exclusively over the weekend and had much better results as well. I think it will get easier and feel more natural with use. My only nit was how quickly the auto exposure meter was set to turn off which as noted in other responses controls the FP as well. Only trade off will be battery life but a 2nd battery can fix that if it depletes too quickly. Thanx for all of the responses and links. Focus and recompose limitations are more clear now. I have been doing 100% more portraits than I have ever done and the DOF/focus plane hadn't occurred to me as part of my problem.

Visit <www.carpemoment.com>.


or http://gary-adkins.fineartamerica.com


Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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JohnE Nikon Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jun 2010Mon 25-Apr-11 03:53 PM
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#26. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 25


New HArtford, US
          

>Moving the AF point around is awkward at first but I used
>that method exclusively over the weekend and had much better
>results as well. I think it will get easier and feel more
>natural with use. My only nit was how quickly the auto
>exposure meter was set to turn off which as noted in other
>responses controls the FP as well. Only trade off will be
>battery life but a 2nd battery can fix that if it depletes too
>quickly. Thanx for all of the responses and links. Focus and
>recompose limitations are more clear now. I have been doing
>100% more portraits than I have ever done and the DOF/focus
>plane hadn't occurred to me as part of my problem.

The exposure meter time is customizable and can be set to stay on longer.
I did appreciate the long battery life as my camera was turned for > 10 hours a couple of days recently and I barely lost any charge.

JohnE Nikon
https://plus.google.com/photos/104310967428146619677/albums?hl=en

https://picasaweb.google.com/104310967428146619677


"Cameras and lenses are simply tools to place our unique vision on film. Concentrate on equipment and you'll take technically good photographs. Concentrate on seeing the light's magic colors and your images will stir the soul." Jack Dykinga

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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kuzzy Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Dec 2005Thu 07-Apr-11 11:48 PM
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#4. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 0


Milford, US
          

FWIW I would suggest moving your focus point using the focus point selector on the rear of the camera whenever possible as opposed to the recompose method. The D7000 tends to really show every little miss in focus and by moving the focus point whenever possible you minimize the chance of changing the distance to subject enough to have it show in your results. There is more info in this thread that may be of help>

http://www.nikonians.org/forums/dcboard.php?az=set_threaded_mode&forum=329&topic_id=6812&prev_page=show_topic&gid=6812#6826

Marc
There are always two people in every picture: the photographer and the viewer.-Ansel Adams

http://500px.com/WhatISaw
http://kuzzy.smugmug.com

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billD80 Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Jan 2007Sun 10-Apr-11 11:04 AM
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#8. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 4


US
          

I recompose all the time... I use the center sensor, AF-S, squeeze the shutter release halfway, recompose, shoot.

I've gotten to where I can be in this hold pattern for quite some time before firing the shutter.

The images I shot of Mariano Rivera, on another thread, were done this way.

Somewhere in the MENU you want to make sure the camera is set to WAIT if it senses movement in the scene. That could cause issues if you've pre-focussed, and recompose...

www.billkeane.zenfolio.com

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Sun 10-Apr-11 03:38 PM
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#10. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 8
Sun 10-Apr-11 03:42 PM by elec164

US
          

>I recompose all the time... I use the center sensor, AF-S,
>squeeze the shutter release halfway, recompose, shoot.
>

One thing not mentioned so far(and as I understand it) is that there is a possible inherent danger in locking focus then recomposing.

I believe it’s more problematic when shooting wide angle, but if the subject is at the far edge of the frame and you use the center AF point to lock focus and then recompose, that would put the subject in front of the focus plane. So depending on the variation from center and the DOF achieved, the subject might not necessarily be as sharp as it could have been if you instead used an outer AF point without the need to recompose (or minimize the amount one needed to).

Just some additional thoughts on this.

Pete

edited to add:

OOPS,, Just saw that JohnE Nikon mentioned this already. But worth repeating I guess!!

Pete

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jmiguez Silver Member Nikonian since 17th Oct 2010Sun 10-Apr-11 03:44 PM
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#11. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 10
Sun 10-Apr-11 03:56 PM by briantilley

Lafayette, US
          


Wouldn't that apply to any focus and recompose? If the intended subject is out of plane with the focus point, you could have focusing issues. The more shallow the DOF the greater the inherent danger.

John

My Pictures may be seen here: http://jmiguez.smugmug.com/

  

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briantilley Moderator Deep knowledge of bodies and lens; high level photography skills Nikonian since 26th Jan 2003Sun 10-Apr-11 03:59 PM
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#12. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 11


Paignton, GB
          

>
>Wouldn't that apply to any focus and recompose?

Yes, to some extent.

The effect is much more noticeable with a wide-angle lens, because the angular movement when re-composing (and hence the change in focus distance) can be much greater.

Personally, I use focus and re-compose all the time with a 105mm lens for portraits, where I only need to change the angle by a few degrees. In these circumstances, the distance changes very little.

Brian
Welsh Nikonian

  

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TakeTwo Silver Member Nikonian since 26th Jul 2009Sun 24-Apr-11 09:22 PM
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#21. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 12


South Lake Tahoe, US
          

>>
>>Wouldn't that apply to any focus and recompose?
>
>Yes, to some extent.
>
>The effect is much more noticeable with a wide-angle lens,
>because the angular movement when re-composing (and hence the
>change in focus distance) can be much greater.


Brian, You are correct. I shoot many stitched panos with a 12mm lens and having my camera rotate on the nodal plane of my lens, I don't see how you could have a focus problem that you are mentioning above unless you are hand held. But then wouldn't that also apply to all lenes to some degree? Does the camera sensor have anything to do with it. With such a wide area of view being written to a sensor on a flat plane I can see where the outside edges of the image would be soft with a narrow DOF.


As long as your nodal plane does not change during your focus setup to your subject you should not have a out of focused image when panning your subject from center to the outside edge. A tripod is mandatory. Sorry if I'm a bit off topic. Don

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Sun 10-Apr-11 04:25 PM
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#13. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 11


US
          

>
>Wouldn't that apply to any focus and recompose?

Yes, but the greater the deviation, the greater the difference. And depending on the DOF, it may be tolerable or may not be.

If you only use the center AF point and the subject is just left or right of center of the scene, then unless you have an unusually narrow DOF it would most likely not be an issue. But if the subject is far left or right in the scene (about as far away from center as you could get, then it would be more of an issue.

Of course as with most things, YMMV.

Pete

Pete

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carpemoment Registered since 17th Dec 2009Sat 23-Apr-11 01:18 PM
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#17. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 13
Sat 23-Apr-11 01:21 PM by carpemoment

Raleigh, US
          

This may be a stupid question but I ascribe to the idea that the only stupid question is the one not asked so no comments from the peanut gallery if you do not! Ha.

What good are all of these focus point sensors anyway other than for moving main subjects and the predictive (is that a word) focusing feature?

What does YMMV mean? I read another post a few days ago asking if there is a translation table somewhere but I don't recall reading an answer.

As to the original post, this has been my biggest problem getting used to my D7000 also. I've used focus/recompose with success since before AF was available and I've never had this much trouble getting it right.

Visit <www.carpemoment.com>.


or http://gary-adkins.fineartamerica.com


Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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four eighty sparky Silver Member Nikonian since 08th Apr 2011Sat 23-Apr-11 02:28 PM
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#18. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 17


US
          


>
>What does YMMV mean? I read another post a few days ago asking
>if there is a translation table somewhere but I don't recall
>reading an answer.
>

Your Mileage May Vary.

Meaning: Your experience may not be exactly the same as someone else's.

  

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carpemoment Registered since 17th Dec 2009Sun 24-Apr-11 04:37 PM
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#19. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 18


Raleigh, US
          

Thanx. That's a new one. Anyone have .02 on my other question?

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or http://gary-adkins.fineartamerica.com


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JosephK Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his excellent and frequent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community in the Nikonians spirit. Nikonian since 17th Apr 2006Sun 24-Apr-11 06:03 PM
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#20. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 17


Seattle, WA, US
          

>What good are all of these focus point sensors anyway other
>than for moving main subjects and the predictive (is that a
>word) focusing feature?

Tracking a moving subject is one use. The other use is to move the focus point to the off-center subject so that you do not need to focus-recompose. As Pete points out in #13, when you focus-recompose you are changing the focal plane. If your DOF is shallow enough this change will move everything out of focus.

When I do focus-recompose, I find that using the af-on methods work great as I know that the camera will not refocus due to poor handling of the shutter release by me.

---------+---------+---------+---------+
Joseph K
Seattle, WA, USA

D200, 17-55mm f/2.8 DX, VR 70-200mm f/2.8 II, 50mm f/1.4 D,
18-70mm f/3.5-4.5 DX, 70-300mm f/4-5.6 ED, D70S

  

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carpemoment Registered since 17th Dec 2009Mon 25-Apr-11 02:55 PM
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#23. "RE: Focus and Recompose.."
In response to Reply # 20


Raleigh, US
          

So having 39 available on the D7000 just gives me 39 points to choose from. The combination of auto points only really comes into play when shooting action shots.

Visit <www.carpemoment.com>.


or http://gary-adkins.fineartamerica.com


Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Forums Lobby GET TO KNOW YOUR CAMERA & MASTER IT Nikon D7100, D7000 (Public) topic #8038 Previous topic | Next topic


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