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Subject: "metering multiple areas without moving focus question" Previous topic | Next topic
Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Sun 09-Dec-12 11:53 PM
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"metering multiple areas without moving focus question"


AU
          

Guys
I will be travelling soon and as such im going to be taking a lot of landscape scenery shots
The place im going to is very sunny but also a very scenic/green area
I am unsure as to what to do when im faced with a situation where I have a bright and sunny day and I have a small river with a lots of greenery around
Where do I meter from given that the sky is going to be very bright and the trees and surrounding will be quite underexposed due to shade
I have seen some topics where people do a few shots and then combine them so they have a few exposures from different areas of the scene into the one shot
Whats the easiest way to do that without moving the focus point.
I have a vauge idea which involves using the exposure and focus lock button, but am unsure how to use it
Hope that’s making sense.
Cheers

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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JosephK Silver Member
10th Dec 2012
1
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Tucsonmr2
10th Dec 2012
5
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ShrimpBoy Silver Member
10th Dec 2012
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JosephK Silver Member
10th Dec 2012
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Tucsonmr2
10th Dec 2012
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km6xz Moderator
10th Dec 2012
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Tucsonmr2
12th Dec 2012
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km6xz Moderator
12th Dec 2012
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Rassie Silver Member
10th Dec 2012
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Tucsonmr2
10th Dec 2012
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Tucsonmr2
13th Dec 2012
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aolander Silver Member
13th Dec 2012
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Tucsonmr2
17th Dec 2012
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18th Dec 2012
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ericbowles Moderator
18th Dec 2012
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JosephK Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his excellent and frequent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community in the Nikonians spirit. Nikonian since 17th Apr 2006Mon 10-Dec-12 12:06 AM
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#1. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 0


Seattle, WA, US
          

Sounds like you are looking for the exposure bracketing controls.

---------+---------+---------+---------+
Joseph K
Seattle, WA, USA

D700, D200, D70S, 24-70mm f/2.8, VR 70-200mm f/2.8 II,
50mm f/1.4 D, 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 VR, 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5 DX

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Mon 10-Dec-12 01:27 AM
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#5. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 1


AU
          

>Sounds like you are looking for the exposure bracketing
>controls.
>
>---------+---------+---------+---------+
>Joseph K
>Seattle, WA, USA
>
>D700, D200, D70S, 24-70mm f/2.8, VR 70-200mm f/2.8 II,
>50mm f/1.4 D, 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 VR, 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5 DX
>


wouldnt the bracketing function only bracket for the exposure i expose for first the over and under expose that???

im thinking to expose for the sky then using the same focus points expose for the tree or somethign similar without having to refocus or touch anything else (not sure how to do this though) then combine it together
if its not worth the effort or you think im talking rubbish then let me know as this is somethign i havent dont before and am only getting to know the camera properly so i dont want to blow my chances of getting a good picture while on holidays

to the guys who have suggested to leaving it and just shoot normally thanks thats what i would have ended up doing but thought id ask here just in case there was a better way to do it

cheers fellas

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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ShrimpBoy Silver Member Nikonian since 08th Jan 2006Mon 10-Dec-12 03:16 AM
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#6. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 5
Mon 10-Dec-12 03:17 AM by ShrimpBoy

Brighton and Hove, GB
          

>wouldnt the bracketing function only bracket for the exposure
>i expose for first the over and under expose that???

Yes.

>im thinking to expose for the sky then using the same focus
>points expose for the tree or somethign similar without having
>to refocus or touch anything else (not sure how to do this
>though) then combine it together

Assuming the light isn't continually changing, you could hand-hold the camera to manually spot meter each of these areas. Note the exposures. Then put the camera on the tripod to frame the shot you actually want, focus, and shoot it in manual mode at the various exposures. But if you're looking to use HDR, the usual thing is to shoot a sequence of frames at a fixed exposure increment, say three or five frames at a two-stop interval. For a realistic look where you just want to brighten up the shadows a bit and tame blown-out highlights, three frames should do.

Personally I've become a fan of metering off the sky if it's a nice blue. Depending upon how light the sky is, I might go anywhere between plus two thirds of a stop (lighter blue) and minus two thirds (deeper blue). As Stan said, if you shoot RAW you can bring up the shadows in post-processing and get your shot with a single exposure.

Gary
"Yea, Sussex by the sea!" - Rudyard Kipling

  

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JosephK Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his excellent and frequent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community in the Nikonians spirit. Nikonian since 17th Apr 2006Mon 10-Dec-12 08:14 AM
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#8. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 5


Seattle, WA, US
          

>wouldnt the bracketing function only bracket for the exposure
>i expose for first the over and under expose that???

By default, yes. However, you can setup the bracketting to be all in one direction if you want. See the exposure/bracketing section of the manual.

>im thinking to expose for the sky then using the same focus
>points expose for the tree or somethign similar without having
>to refocus or touch anything else (not sure how to do this
>though) then combine it together

Using spot metering or center-weighted you can set the exposure, lock it, then focus and recompose; repeat for each exposure difference.

It would probably be easier to check the metering at your multiple points, then either bracket the exposure manually or automatically.
One advantage to the autobracketing is that when the camera is in continuous release mode (CL or CH), it will take all of the shots in the bracketing sequence then stop when you hold down the shutter release.

>if its not worth the effort or you think im talking rubbish
>then let me know as this is somethign i havent dont before and
>am only getting to know the camera properly so i dont want to
>blow my chances of getting a good picture while on holidays

Don't underestimate the accuracy of the camera's matrix metering.

---------+---------+---------+---------+
Joseph K
Seattle, WA, USA

D700, D200, D70S, 24-70mm f/2.8, VR 70-200mm f/2.8 II,
50mm f/1.4 D, 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 VR, 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5 DX

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Mon 10-Dec-12 12:06 AM
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#2. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 0


AU
          

this is probably what im likely to encounter

https://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&safe=active&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bpcl=39650382&biw=891&bih=415&wrapid=tlif135510082018510&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=nTLFUJupD4aZ0QWa34CwBQ&q=vaikom%20backwaters&tbo=d#um=1&hl=en&safe=active&tbo=d&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=kerala+backwaters&oq=kerala+backwaters&gs_l=img.3..0l10.142770.145203.2.145406.8.7.0.0.0.0.1248.1248.7-1.1.0...0.0...1c.1.hxjhdpUUH08&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=20152a1f666ed1c6&bpcl=39650382&biw=891&bih=415

also a good way to capture this scene would be very helpfull

https://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&safe=active&q=chinese+fishing+nets+kochi&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bpcl=39650382&biw=891&bih=415&wrapid=tlif135510140359210&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=9TTFUKCmC-qc0QWblIHACg

camera is a D7000 and am using the 18-105, will most likely be taking a tripod
debating on wethere to take a ND filtera nd polarising filter
i will se shooting in raw if that makes it any easier in helping me

Many thanks in advance


http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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km6xz Moderator Awarded for his in-depth knowledge in various areas, including Portraits and Urban Photography Nikonian since 22nd Jan 2009Mon 10-Dec-12 12:45 AM
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#4. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 2
Mon 10-Dec-12 12:46 AM by km6xz

St Petersburg, RU
          

In those scenes, a polarizing filter would be a big help to reduce the refection from water. Unless you are doing HDR brackets, the D7000 has such good DR that I would shoot in RAW and meter for the high tones and bring up the mids and shadows in post which will be essentially noiseless if shooting at low ISO. I would also avoid mid-day shooting unless there is filtered shade for subject illumination, or using powerful flash for fill of the hard shadows that will be created mid-day. The D7000 should do well in those conditions if you mind the high tones.
Stan
St Petersburg Russia

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Wed 12-Dec-12 12:27 AM
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#9. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 4
Wed 12-Dec-12 08:25 AM by briantilley

AU
          

>In those scenes, a polarizing filter would be a big help to
>reduce the refection from water. Unless you are doing HDR
>brackets, the D7000 has such good DR that I would shoot in RAW
>and meter for the high tones and bring up the mids and shadows
>in post which will be essentially noiseless if shooting at low
>ISO. I would also avoid mid-day shooting unless there is
>filtered shade for subject illumination, or using powerful
>flash for fill of the hard shadows that will be created
>mid-day. The D7000 should do well in those conditions if you
>mind the high tones.

i have just re-read your post properly
what do you mean when you say

>meter for the high tones and bring up the mids and shadows
>in post which will be essentially noiseless if shooting at low
>ISO

would help me if you can explain wat exactly i need to do as im still a novice
cheers

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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km6xz Moderator Awarded for his in-depth knowledge in various areas, including Portraits and Urban Photography Nikonian since 22nd Jan 2009Wed 12-Dec-12 08:53 AM
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#10. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 9


St Petersburg, RU
          

The dynamic range of the D7000 is really impressive at low ISO where landscapes are normally taken. But even with the extended DR, a scene with dark shadows and bright highlights exceed the range of light intensity that the camera or any camera can record.
So taking the photo, using the light meter built in will concentrate on getting the mid tones right with the extremes of dark and light might be lost due to clipping in the highs and dark shadows containing so little data that they are black, also representing lost data.
The D7000 shot at low ISO and in RAW format preserves more data at the high and low ranges than any other DX camera so even when shadows appear to be black, they contain recoverable data. The data can be recovered by adding gain or shifting the digitial numerical data up in value for values below some threshold you set when using the sliders in programs like Lightroom.
So, exposing to the brightest portion of the scene, and not middle grey like the meter is trying to do, you assure that the high tones are not clipped and skies and sunsets retain all the data possible. That results in an image displayed on your screen that is very dark in what appears to your eye as merely shadows. Download that file to your computer and using LR or any of the other editing software that can dislay RAW files. Now, you can adjust the gain, or brightness of the deep blackened shadows with shadow and exposure controls. Exposure controls all ranges but the shadow recovery section allows increasing the level of the deep shadows to they return to their normal appearance when viewed at the time of capture by your eye. Up tp about 4 stops of shadow recovery is possible without adding much noise. White Balance will also have to be adjusted or set to automatically adjust WB when importing a new image.
You can get the same sort of selective exposure adjustment by using a Graduated Neutural Density filter that allows more light loss at the top of the frame so the highlights are not too strong to capture all the detail and tone range. But the above method works well without any new gear to buy.
Stan
St Petersburg Russia

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Rassie Silver Member Nikonian since 08th Jan 2006Mon 10-Dec-12 12:43 AM
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#3. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 0


Milton, CA
          

I would just shoot the scene with matrix metering selected. Then evaluate the picture by looking at the histogram on the display. You could also look at the blinkies of the picture on the display. If the exposure needs adjustment, then use positive or negative exposure compensation to fine tune the exposure and re-shoot the scene.

I think you will find in many cases the camera will do just fine.

Regards

My Nikonians gallery

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Mon 10-Dec-12 05:09 AM
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#7. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 3


AU
          

Thanks guys
not looking to do a HDR shot if anyones wondering just hoping for the best advice on how to get the best shot for the above scenarios
the pic links i have posted are excatly where i will be going.

cheers

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Thu 13-Dec-12 04:25 AM
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#11. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 7


AU
          

Thanks once again mate for your help its very much appreciated.

Some more question if you don’t mind
When metering for the highs, what metering type do I use, im guessing I have to use spot or centre weight meter type.
I will be using view nx for converting and editing

Also I just found something on the camera in relation to what I was asking before (not moving the focus point permanently(camera on tripod) and still being able to meter off various areas on the frame)
I worked out that just pointing the focus point to where I want to meter is enough for the camera to meter the area (I previously thought I had to press the shutter release half way for the meter to work)
Also worked out that by changing the function setting on the AE-L, AF-L to AE-L (hold) I can move the focus point to the dark area then meter hold, then use the OK button to set the focus point back to middle, autofocus again (but im guessing a manual focus will achieve a better result so that depth of field doesn’t accidently get changed) take the shot then meter for brighter areas on the scene in the same way and repeat until I have a few different metered exposures of the same scene then combine the pictures in photoshop or something likewise..
I know it’s a long winded way to do things but that’s what I just found out lol
Im guessing theres easier ways to do this and one of them is to use the matrix metering mode. And another to use the bracketing feature
I will try a few different methods and see which ones come out best..

Im buying some ND filters to take with me as a backup just in case (just some cheap ones for now to practice)

Cheers

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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aolander Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Sep 2006Thu 13-Dec-12 01:24 PM
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#12. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 11


Nevis, US
          

"Im buying some ND filters to take with me as a backup just in case"

I'm not sure that these will help you any. They reduce the exposure over the whole scene, so all you end up with is an exposure taken with a wider aperture, slower shutter speed, or higher ISO. The scene will look the same, exposure wise. ND filters are most often used with brightly lit scenes where you want to use a slow shutter speed to obtain motion effects, like flowing water.

Alan

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Tucsonmr2 Registered since 08th Nov 2012Mon 17-Dec-12 11:27 PM
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#13. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 12


AU
          

The ND filter will be used for waterfalls or when i need architecture isolated from people moving around etc etc.

cheers for the help guys, much appreciated..

http://www.flickr.com/photos/80080326@N04

  

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Gray_star Registered since 17th Dec 2012Tue 18-Dec-12 04:53 AM
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#14. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

>Guys
>I will be travelling soon and as such im going to be taking a
>lot of landscape scenery shots
>The place im going to is very sunny but also a very
>scenic/green area
>I am unsure as to what to do when im faced with a situation
>where I have a bright and sunny day and I have a small river
>with a lots of greenery around
>Where do I meter from given that the sky is going to be very
>bright and the trees and surrounding will be quite
>underexposed due to shade

In bright conditions such as what you're describing, the simplest solution is to use the old Sunny 16 rule. Just set aperture to f/16 (which is your landscape aperture anyways) set ISO to 100 and shutter to 1/100s. That should give you correct exposure.

>I have seen some topics where people do a few shots and then
>combine them so they have a few exposures from different areas
>of the scene into the one shot
>Whats the easiest way to do that without moving the focus
>point.

Generally, the process is to use manual settings. So set M mode and set your exposure as above. You can auto focus or manually focus...it doesn't matter much as your focus will likely be set to infinity.

  

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ericbowles Moderator Awarded for his in-depth knowledge and high level skills in various areas, especially Landscape and Wildlife Photoghraphy Writer Ribbon awarded for for his article contributions to the community Nikonian since 25th Nov 2005Tue 18-Dec-12 04:57 PM
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#15. "RE: metering multiple areas without moving focus question"
In response to Reply # 0


Atlanta, US
          

I think you may be worrying too much.

Matrix metering on the D7000 is very good. You need to be able to dial in positive or negative exposure compensation - depending on the scene, but there is no compelling need to do a lot of spot metering and complex exposure management for the images in your link.

The key to metering is to use your highlights display (blinkies) and your histograms. I find the histograms are difficult to use for small overexposed areas, so the blinking highlights are more useful. Just dial in exposure compensation so you eliminate most or all of the blinking highlights.

I would certainly use a circular polarizer - you have reflections on water, off foliage, and in the sky. A ND filter is good for waterfalls, but nothing beats even light from overcast or rainy conditions. For sunny rivers, don't use the CP to kill all reflections. Instead, adjust the CP to optimize the reflections in the water.

If you are using Nikon View or Capture for post processing, you probably can get some help by using ADL Low. ADL Normal and beyond adjusts your exposure as well, and I try to avoid exposure adjustments.

You can create a HDR image from multiple shots - essentially bracketing in two stop intervals. It's done in software as long as you have the images to use.

Keep in mind that there are specific things that can influence the exposure even with Matrix metering. If you have a lot of bright sky in the frame, the camera will try to make the exposure darker. If you have a lot of dark, polarized water or bright green foliage, the camera will try to make the scene brighter - more toward neutral tone.

One thing you have not mentioned is white balance. I find auto WB tends to neutralize the great color in a scene, so you might want to use Daylight WB. Of course, that's if you are using software that will honor the camera settings like View or Capture.

Eric Bowles
Nikonians Team
My Gallery
Workshops

Nikonians membership — my most important photographic investment, after the camera

  

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