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Subject: "No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!" Previous topic | Next topic
csgaraglino Silver Member Charter MemberWed 17-Nov-10 08:23 PM
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"No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"


Colorado Springs, US
          

Got my D7000 about an hour ago... No hot pixels!

Gotta thank Doris at Robert's Imaging (http://www.robertsimaging.com) for hooking me up with this body!

---
Regards,
Chris Sgaraglino
Outdoor Studios Photography || on Flickr || on Google+

  

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Replies to this topic
Subject Author Message Date ID
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
radwar Silver Member
17th Nov 2010
1
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
csgaraglino Silver Member
17th Nov 2010
2
     Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
kuzzy Silver Member
17th Nov 2010
3
          Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
Robman3 Gold Member
17th Nov 2010
4
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
teaksmith
18th Nov 2010
5
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
jd717
18th Nov 2010
6
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
robinje
18th Nov 2010
7
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
elec164 Silver Member
18th Nov 2010
8
     Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
Chris Ross Leong
18th Nov 2010
9
          Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
elec164 Silver Member
18th Nov 2010
11
Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
DrBrett Silver Member
18th Nov 2010
10
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KnightPhoto Gold Member
19th Nov 2010
12
     Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
Chris Ross Leong
19th Nov 2010
13
          Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
nobrainer
01st Aug 2013
14
               Reply message RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!
km6xz Moderator
01st Aug 2013
15

radwar Silver Member Nikonian since 28th Feb 2009Wed 17-Nov-10 08:36 PM
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#1. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 0


Cupertino, US
          

>Got my D7000 about an hour ago... No hot pixels!
>
>Gotta thank Doris at Robert's Imaging
>(http://www.robertsimaging.com) for hooking me up with this
>body!

I should get the body from Robert's tomorrow.. how do you test for the hot pixels?

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csgaraglino Silver Member Charter MemberWed 17-Nov-10 09:23 PM
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#2. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 1


Colorado Springs, US
          

What I did was shot some basic video with both lights & brights (just for a baseline) and then shot a second video with the lens cap on (solid black).

Previewed both.

---
Regards,
Chris Sgaraglino
Outdoor Studios Photography || on Flickr || on Google+

  

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kuzzy Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Dec 2005Wed 17-Nov-10 11:27 PM
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#3. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 2


Milford, US
          

Hey Chris, Got mine today from Roberts as well. I do not see any hot pixels either, not a one. Glad to see you made out well. Have fun.

Marc
There are always two people in every picture: the photographer and the viewer.-Ansel Adams

http://500px.com/WhatISaw
http://kuzzy.smugmug.com

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Robman3 Gold Member Nikonian since 12th Apr 2010Wed 17-Nov-10 11:39 PM
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#4. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 3


West of Santa Monica, US
          

If I have a hot pixel, it will have to wait until I can swap it back, 30 days at Samy's.

I'll need to keep it for a gig until then, pixel or not.

Rob

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teaksmith Registered since 02nd Feb 2009Thu 18-Nov-10 12:22 AM
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#5. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Mine arrived yesterday from Robert's as well. No hot pixels that I can see.

Scott

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jd717 Registered since 11th Nov 2010Thu 18-Nov-10 01:24 AM
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#6. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 5


US
          

Received mine from Dawn at Robert's yesterday... no hot pixels.

  

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robinje Basic MemberThu 18-Nov-10 03:44 AM
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#7. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 0


Minneapolis, US
          

My D7000 will arrive tomorrow. So what's the most thorough procedure to check for 'hot' pixels? Movie with the lens cap on, or other?

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Thu 18-Nov-10 02:11 PM
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#8. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 7


US
          

>So what's the most thorough procedure to check for 'hot' pixels?

The problem in testing to me is that the term ‘Hot Pixel’ is applied to generally. The visual phenomenon people call hot pixel’s which appear as noise in an image can occur from three different sources (as I presently understand it) which would need a different means of testing. The three different sources would be a stuck sensel, shot noise and thermal noise. The dark frame test is generally used for thermal noise and is the basis of long exposure (source of most thermal noise) noise reduction. Depending on the algorithms of the demosaic process a lens cap test may or may not show a stuck sensel. Shot noise or the different response of adjacent sensels to the same light stimulus will only be triggered by taking an actual image.

So to me the best way to practically test for “Hot Pixels” is to take images of scenes of varying brightness and content, then view the images on screen at about 60 to 100% view.

For instance I believe I have a stuck sensel almost dead center of the sensor array. Depending on the scene it sometimes is not evident if the surrounding sensels are of a similar signal strength which then, to the demosaic algorithm, it appears as a normal reading. But if the surrounding sensels are at a low signal then the stuck one appears hot and shows up as a white or greenish cross. Yesterday I was doing some testing and did a 25 second exposure with no noise reduction and almost spontaneously broke out into a chorus of “Oh Starry Night”. It took an 100% view to see most of them so I imagine in just making an 8x10 print they would not be an issue.

So with everyone here reporting no hot pixels, it makes me wonder if there might be a QC issue with this sensor. My finding a hot pixel easily in the imaging-resource samples was surprising. I would think they get loaners from Nikon to do this testing and if so I would have thought Nikon would go over the camera to insure proper functioning to put their best foot forward. Perhaps I am wrong about the loaners though. Granted this is my first CMOS sensor camera so perhaps this is normal and I may be being a little overly critical. But while my Olympus C4040 did develop stuck sensels over the years of its usage, it included a utility in the menus for pixel mapping eliminating the need for a cost repair. And quite frankly I never experienced any issue like this with my D80. Given my experience (as well as a few others it seems) it can only make me wonder.

Pete

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Chris Ross Leong Registered since 18th Nov 2010Thu 18-Nov-10 05:00 PM
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#9. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 8


Sherman Oaks, US
          

None here either.
Shot several movie clips in varying lighting, day and night. Will shoot the black cap test in a minute...
.. nope, all black, no hot pixels here.
S/N 30111xx

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Thu 18-Nov-10 06:29 PM
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#11. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 9
Thu 18-Nov-10 06:31 PM by elec164

US
          

>None here either.
>Shot several movie clips in varying lighting, day and night.

I keep forgetting you guys are mainly concerned with video. My earlier comments were about still images only. Out of curiosity I just shot some test videos indoors in just available window light.

I am now pretty sure that I have a stuck sensel at approximately position 2215x1520 in the array. I also see evidence in low light areas of possibly a blue and red hot pixel somewhere in the bottom left area of the screen. These were easily seen when viewing the videos on a 4:3 aspect 19 inch monitor using fit to screen with Quicktime and a screen resolution of 86PPI.

Still makes me wonder about the QC issue.

Pete

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DrBrett Silver Member Nikonian since 23rd Apr 2006Thu 18-Nov-10 05:59 PM
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#10. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 0


Vancouver, CA
          

I have around 7 hot pixels visible when shooting video only, not stills. Most are not a problem and mostly visible at higher ISO but I have one fairly bright blue pixel at 1 o'clock around 1/4 of the way out from center that is annoying. I'm going to do more video of dark scenes and see if it is a distraction; I am also going to inform my vendor in advance in case I decide to return it. A bit of a disappointment, but not earth-shattering for me.

Brett

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KnightPhoto Gold Member Nikonian since 18th Dec 2006Fri 19-Nov-10 01:42 AM
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#12. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 10


Alberta, CA
          

I propose a question: could this phenomena be a software problem? In which case we could expect a firmware fix

I have two hot/stuck pixels in video mode evident when I pan because they stay in place and therefore stand out from the background.

Here's my question - the sensor pixel dimensions FAR exceed the pixel dimensions of the video. Therefore there is a "downsizing/compression" going on to get down to 1080P or in my case I have been shooting even smaller at 720P.

Then there is the Second compression using AVCHD to save space in storage.

With all that compression going on what are the chances these are some kind of error in the software performing these size reductions.

It just seems odd to me that with all these sensor pixels being thrown away what are the chances these same two hot pixels are never getting thrown away and are always present in each frame of my video?

Doesn't a hardware hot pixel always showing in a video seem very unlikely? Whereas if it's a software bug the chances seem much more likely as long as the conditions are present to trigger the bug.

Just thinking out loud here, would be interested in comments.


Best regards, SteveK

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Chris Ross Leong Registered since 18th Nov 2010Fri 19-Nov-10 02:10 AM
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#13. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 12
Fri 19-Nov-10 02:12 AM by Chris Ross Leong

Sherman Oaks, US
          

SteveK, hello!
Good question. Don't suppose there's a way of telling right off the bat, unless someone from Nikon is reading this thread and starts investigating.

Or someone reverse engineers the HDMI output, which is a more likely event and probably just a matter of time. The NanoFlash folk or similar, probably, since they'll want to get to the signal before all that compression kicks in.

The output looks very good to my eye already, so once the card codec is bypassed I'm sure we'll be seeing some pretty spectacular results.

  

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nobrainer Registered since 01st Aug 2013Thu 01-Aug-13 07:15 AM
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#14. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 13


DE
          

Well actually it makes sense. At least for frames where the hot/stuck pixel will be very prominently visible due to contrast. The compression algorithms usually try to loose as little information as possible, and if you look at the brightly glowing pixel in the middle of nowhere, a computer would consider it relevant. While the algorith can easily say sth like: "black between pixels 1000-20004" for any area that is mostly black, it would certainly try to preserve the one white pixel in between, considering it relevant. As the stuck pixels are actually recorded by the sensor, who seems to really perceive this specific pixel as white/red/green all the time, the consequence is, that it remains visible even if you compress the video with divx at the lowest bitrate.

I am having the same big white spot more or less in the middle of my videos (D7100, brand new) and it really is annoying. Thinking of returning it and checking out sth else if the issue is wide spread.

nobrainer

  

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km6xz Moderator Awarded for his in-depth knowledge in various areas, including Portraits and Urban Photography Nikonian since 22nd Jan 2009Thu 01-Aug-13 12:43 PM
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#15. "RE: No HOT Pixels - Woo-Who!"
In response to Reply # 14


St Petersburg, RU
          

Hello Nobrainer, Welcome to Nikonians
You responded to a 2 year old post and soon after this thread was being conducted Nikon released a firmware update that addressed this and a few other issues. It has not been a problem since. The D7100 uses a different sensor design and I have not heard of this problem mentioned on this or other forums.

We Nikonians prefer to keep the forum friendly so we ask that everyone fill out their profile with full name and equipment and experience level so we can assist our members better.

Thank you

Stan
St Petersburg Russia

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