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Subject: "D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card" Previous topic | Next topic
Vlad_IT Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Sep 2011Fri 02-Dec-11 04:39 PM
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"D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
Sat 03-Dec-11 02:28 AM by Vlad_IT

US
          

Hi, all

I just wanted to share my experience. Tested my new 32Gb SanDisk Extreme Pro SDHC UHS-I Card rated at 95MB/s.

I shoot a sequence in Raw with shutter speed set to 1/640c. Sadly there is ALMOST no gain in speed for clearing buffer to the card compare to "regular" Class 10 cards. Buffer has been cleared from r00 to r10 (all available) in about 9-10 seconds. The same test with Transcend Class 10 card gives me about 11-12 seconds to clear all 10 images from buffer to the card. I’m on the latest FW 1.02/1.02/1.03.

When buffer is full and i still continue holding shutter release down I’ll gain set of 2 images every second, but it doesn't slow to the rate 2 images per second - it gives me a two images immediately every second.

I was really hopping to see “useful” in-camera speed using UHS-I card, but camera is not utilizing UHS-I speeds, Nikon just “allowed” to use newer generation of cards in D7000…. That’s lame...

So my verdict – the Nikon in-camera data transfer speed is a bottleneck for transferring data to the SD card and not the card top speed. There is no advantage in-camera for using any faster cards then SanDisk Extreme III rated @30MB/s. Faster cards may help you to transfer faster your pictures to the hard drive, but it will not help you with small D7000 buffer size issue….


Best regards,
Vlad

  

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Replies to this topic
Subject Author Message Date ID
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
J_Harris Silver Member
02nd Dec 2011
1
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
KnightPhoto Gold Member
04th Dec 2011
5
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
SaurianFire
02nd Dec 2011
2
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Vlad_IT Silver Member
03rd Dec 2011
3
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
RockyIII Gold Member
03rd Dec 2011
4
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
NDGraham Silver Member
04th Dec 2011
6
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Lempa
09th Dec 2011
7
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
ericbowles Moderator
09th Dec 2011
8
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Vlad_IT Silver Member
09th Dec 2011
9
     Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Lempa
09th Dec 2011
10
          Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Vlad_IT Silver Member
09th Dec 2011
11
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
blw Moderator
09th Dec 2011
12
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
Len Shepherd Gold Member
09th Dec 2011
13
     Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
blw Moderator
09th Dec 2011
14
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
texspeel Silver Member
09th Dec 2011
15
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
billr814
04th Jan 2012
16
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
RRRoger Silver Member
05th Jan 2012
17
Reply message RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card
gkaiseril Gold Member
05th Jan 2012
18

J_Harris Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Mar 2011Fri 02-Dec-11 08:47 PM
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#1. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Thanks for the very helpful review. Maybe it would improve "video" performance, did you do any testing using video?

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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KnightPhoto Gold Member Nikonian since 18th Dec 2006Sun 04-Dec-11 05:12 AM
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#5. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 1


Alberta, CA
          

>Thanks for the very helpful review. Maybe it would improve
>"video" performance, did you do any testing using
>video?
>

I'm pretty sure video is even less demanding than compared to shooting stills and needing the buffer cleared quickly after it fills. IIRC a Class 6 card is good enough for keeping up with video.

Back to the OP, Thanks Vlad for the real-world experience. It's what I feared based on some earlier threads here. On an earlier thread a 30mbps card cleared the buffer in 9 seconds and a 45mbps card cleared it in 7 seconds. So there is still an advantage in the latter, but you have proven that there isn't an advantage jumping all the way up to 90mbps.

Best regards, SteveK

'A camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.' -- Dorothea Lange
My Nikonians gallery
My Nikonians Blog

  

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SaurianFire Registered since 11th Feb 2011Fri 02-Dec-11 11:40 PM
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#2. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

> The same test with Transcend Class 10 card gives
>me about 11-12 seconds to clear all 10 images from buffer to
>the card.

Hi Vlad

Disappointing news.

Exactly which Transcend card did you use???

Respectfully,
Frank

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Vlad_IT Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Sep 2011Sat 03-Dec-11 12:52 AM
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#3. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 2


US
          

Hey. I’m not supposed to post the external links, but please search amazon for TS16GSDHC10E
I have two of those and they both work well. I was looking for a deal for SanDisk Extreme Pro 45MB/s cards, hopping to get some improvement in high speed shooting, but came across this 32GB 95MB/s and decided to give it a try – I’m very disappointed with the results - not even sure if I can return the open card, but that's another story.

Best regards,
Vlad

  

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RockyIII Gold Member Nikonian since 27th May 2006Sat 03-Dec-11 01:38 AM
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#4. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Raleigh, US
          

Vlad,

Thanks for posting the results of your test.

Rocky

  

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NDGraham Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Jan 2007Sun 04-Dec-11 09:22 PM
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#6. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Dorval (Montreal), CA
          

Thank you for taking the time to share the results of your test with us, Vlad. It is a subject of interest for me since I have only had my D7000 for a week and I have been wondering if the higher end (and higher cost) cards are worth the expense. I just purchased two Transcend Class 10 32Gig cards online for $38 each and I am satisfied with the results so far although I admit I have not really subjected my D7000 to much rigorous use yet.
Neill
Proud to be a Montreal Nikonian
http://picasaweb.google.com/NeillDGraham

  

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Lempa Registered since 27th Oct 2011Fri 09-Dec-11 02:14 AM
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#7. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Malmö, SE
          

> When buffer is full and i still continue holding shutter
>release down I’ll gain set of 2 images every second, but it
>doesn't slow to the rate 2 images per second - it gives me a
>two images immediately every second.
>
>I was really hopping to see “useful” in-camera speed using
>UHS-I card, but camera is not utilizing UHS-I speeds, Nikon
>just “allowed” to use newer generation of cards in D7000….
>That’s lame...
>
>So my verdict – the Nikon in-camera data transfer speed is a
>bottleneck for transferring data to the SD card...(etc)

I also bought a 95MB/s SDHC card just to see what difference in sequence speed it would make, if any, compared to the 15 and 30MB/s write speed cards I already had. I'm really sad to say it, but if there is any difference in real write speed, which I could hardly notice, you're absolutely right about the bottleneck of the D7000's with a buffer that suffers from bad headroom!

My camera is with the 95 card acting exactly as you describe it Vlad!
Pain, but no gain!

I just hope for a firmware update that can split the exposures to each of the two cards from one card to the other every other picture like someone suggested in the forum before. Probably that's just wishful thinking...?

I am at the moment quite disappointed too with this issue, but that's about the only thing I feel is a problem with this otherwise great piece of gear!

/Timmy

  

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ericbowles Moderator Awarded for his in-depth knowledge and high level skills in various areas, especially Landscape and Wildlife Photoghraphy Writer Ribbon awarded for for his article contributions to the community Nikonian since 25th Nov 2005Fri 09-Dec-11 03:20 PM
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#8. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Atlanta, US
          

Vlad

Thanks for posting. Too bad - hopefully Nikon can address improving write speeds in the future - or give us a larger buffer.

Were the download speeds noticeably faster with the new card?


Eric Bowles
Nikonians Team
My Gallery
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Nikonians membership — my most important photographic investment, after the camera

  

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Vlad_IT Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Sep 2011Fri 09-Dec-11 03:49 PM
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#9. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 8


US
          

>Were the download speeds noticeably faster with the new card?
>
>


Eric,

i do not have UHS-I compatibale card reader, so for me it's still as good as it gets on built-in notebook reader. Sorry
Best regards,
Vlad

  

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Lempa Registered since 27th Oct 2011Fri 09-Dec-11 04:21 PM
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#10. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 9


Malmö, SE
          

>Were the download speeds noticeably faster with the new card?
>
>

Direct download from camera (via Nikon transfer), no difference that I could notice, but from card reader it seems to speed up transfer a step or two. I haven't done a proper readspeed test, this is just a first few indications that I can observe.

/Timmy

  

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Vlad_IT Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Sep 2011Fri 09-Dec-11 04:43 PM
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#11. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 10


US
          

Eric,

With proper UHS-I card reader the sky should be a limit (or it should be excactly 3.5 times faster than your "regular" class 10 20+/- MB/s transfers

Timmy,
I haven't tried USB cable transfer, but based on your input I have a feeling that built-in in camera card reader(s) has its speed limit and dedicated card reader will be potentially much faster data transfer

from google search:

"In short, even though the Nikon D7000 is compatible with the SD Association’s UHS-I specifications, it does not appear to take full advantage of what SanDisk is delivering in the Extreme Pro UHS-I SD card."


Best regards,
Vlad

  

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blw Moderator Awarded for his high level of expertise in various areas Nikonian since 18th Jun 2004Fri 09-Dec-11 04:46 PM
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#12. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri 09-Dec-11 04:51 PM by blw

Richmond, US
          

This is pretty typical. Remember that these improved speeds are enabled by new hardware implementations. Nikon has to lock down the design almost a year before it appears on the market, to allow time for suppliers to get them volumes, test the implementation and associated firmware and get into production. The cameras are usually stuck at the speed of chips that are readily available in sampling quantities a year before the camera launches. In this case, the camera was launched in September 2010, so the technology in the camera is what was available in the summer of 2009.

It's not really a matter of "allowing" it - this is usually all that the vendors can do without going to step function in price. Also, don't forget that it's not just a matter of the SD card interface, although it may seem that way. For a faster SD card to matter, the entire pipeline has to improve in speed. I have no idea at all of the internal details of the D7000, but it could very well be that the SD interface is fully capable of going 95MB/sec. But if the image processor can't produce more than the 2 fps, that won't make any difference at all. I don't design cameras, but I do work in a related field. Getting the entire pipeline to go 3x faster is virtually guaranteed to cost 4-5x as much. Now that's not the entire cost of the camera - hardly, in fact - but it's still significant. The image processing pipeline is likely to be on the order of a quarter of the cost (not price) of components, so 4x change on that would materially affect the retail price, and therefore positioning, of the final product.

_____
Brian... a bicoastal Nikonian and Team Member

My gallery is online. Comments and critique welcomed any time!

  

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Len Shepherd Gold Member Nikonian since 09th Mar 2003Fri 09-Dec-11 05:23 PM
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#13. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 12


Yorkshire, GB
          

>I do work in a related field. Getting the entire pipeline to go 3x faster is virtually guaranteed to cost 4-5x as much.
>Now that's not the entire cost of the camera - hardly, in fact - but it's still significant.
A good point - and one of the reasons why the D300s is more expensive than the D7000.
Pure speculation by me but if the "D400" launch is put back 3 moths due to the Thailand floods there should be time to further refine and improve the components in it and to further improve performance.

Photography is a bit like archery. A technically better camera, lens or arrow may not hit the target as often as it could if the photographer or archer does not practice enough.

Len Shepherd

  

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blw Moderator Awarded for his high level of expertise in various areas Nikonian since 18th Jun 2004Fri 09-Dec-11 06:24 PM
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#14. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 13


Richmond, US
          

> Pure speculation by me but if the "D400" launch is put back 3 moths due to the Thailand floods there should be time to further refine and improve the components in it and to further improve performance.

I doubt it, unless the launch was really much further away than we thought. If it was scheduled for sometime in late 2011, the design decisions were made in 2009 and the component decisions were finalized in late 2010. Remember that not only are there technical considerations, but also mundane stuff like contracts. By the time the floods hit in October 2011, everything except the final version of the firmware should have been locked down. Improving performance by changing even a single, commodity chip available from multiple suppliers likely had to be done in the first calendar quarter of 2011. If the change had to go into a more critical chip - such as an EXPEED - that probably had to be done in 2010 at the latest.

In this case it is likely that there ARE changes to the components happening at the last minute. But those would almost certainly be driven by the lack of availability of components and change in supply chain. Based solely on what I'm going through in my business I think it's a safe assumption that Nikon has been affected at least as badly and likely much worse. We've locked down our designs and are accepting only emergency changes, such as would be required due to a supplier that is physically unable to supply product. There are enough of those that any sane product boss at Nikon would reject any performance-related change out of hand, simply to avoid creating any more risk to getting the product out the door. Remember that not only are they having to change at least some component suppliers at the last moment (actually probably well after the last moment), they're also bringing up manufacturing of a new product in a new factory, very likely using at least a fair proportion of new staff. They're down a billion US dollars in revenue due to the flood, and no additional risk to getting production restarted would be tolerated.

_____
Brian... a bicoastal Nikonian and Team Member

My gallery is online. Comments and critique welcomed any time!

  

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texspeel Silver Member Nikonian since 09th Nov 2011Fri 09-Dec-11 10:49 PM
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#15. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Fairfax Station, US
          

Vlad,
That's a real bummer but thanks for posting. You saved me some money.
Best regards,
Tom

"Nothing can be recognized without light and shade. It is only through the eye, the window of the soul, that we can truly understand the complex workings of nature." - Leonardo da Vinci

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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billr814 Registered since 05th Dec 2011Wed 04-Jan-12 10:29 PM
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#16. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

  

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RRRoger Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his long history of demonstrated excellence and helping other members with equipment, technique and DSLR video in the true Nikonians spirit. Charter MemberThu 05-Jan-12 01:34 PM
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#17. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 16
Thu 05-Jan-12 01:37 PM by RRRoger

Monterey Bay, US
          

The new D400, D800, and D4 will have the new EXPEED processor.
Hopefully two of them and a lot more memory.

The V1 has both and I wonder how much faster it writes to a SanDisk 95mbs card than the D7000?
That "PipeLine" cost may help explain the high price of the V1.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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gkaiseril Gold Member Nikonian since 28th Oct 2005Thu 05-Jan-12 02:52 PM
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#18. "RE: D7000 and new SanDisk UHS-I 95MB/s card"
In response to Reply # 0


Chicago, US
          

Have you looked at CF/SD Performance Database by Rob Galbratith?

You will find the writing speed for a number of cameras. After reviewing a number of camera models, it become apparent that there is a speed limit imposed by the hardware. This is much like the bus speed of your computer system, no matter how fast the CPU is there is a point where your memory card tops out at data transfer, the same applies to disk drives but the speed of the disk drive becomes the limiting factor.

You may find a small bump in speed but it is not enough to makeup for the increased price. The real value of faster cards come when using the appropriate external card reader to transfer the images to your computer. Note that with the UDMA cards one needs a UDMA reader and possibly the USB 3 port or other port requirements as specified by the manufacturer.

George
My Nikonian Galleries

  

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