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cogrady Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Jan 2009Wed 29-May-13 02:43 PM
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"Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"


Salt Lake City, US
          

Just read this statement from Adobe. Makes me wonder if there is a compromise on the way.

http://blogs.adobe.com/creativecloud/our-move-to-creative-cloud-an-update/


Claudia




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www.lastlightphotographicstudios.com

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RRowlett Silver Member
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RRowlett Silver Member Charter MemberWed 29-May-13 03:51 PM
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#1. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Hamilton, US
          

Well, I hope Adobe is listening. I don't think my university is going to pony up $10 or $20 a month to license me a copy of Adobe Photoshop, even though I use it frequently for photos and for scientific illustration editing at work. After using Photoshop for years, this new pricing model may cause non-professional enthusiasts and educational institutions to look for other alternatives.

I'm already thinking about how I might manage using GIMP, which has come a long way since its beginnings, and supports color management now. I have also used Paintshop Pro, and while it is still OK for illustration editing, color management still isn't up to Photoshop standards. I can always get NEF support from ViewNX2, it just adds a step to the workflow.

What might be the ticket is an enhanced Photoshop Elements with a few more features and maybe a slightly higher price. (Photoshop Elements Pro?)

Cheers.

  

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Lolrogge Silver Member Nikonian since 13th Apr 2012Thu 30-May-13 01:51 AM
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"RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"


Ayden, US
          

I also hope they are listening. I am using LR4 and PSE11. I like PSE, but it is only 8-bit, and I want a 16-bit program. I would like to see an "enhanced" PSE, but it would have to be very enhanced to meet the needs of many in the photographic community.

Laverne

  

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esantos Moderator Nikonians Resources Writer. Recognized for his outstanding reviews on printers and printing articles. Awarded for his high level of expertise in various areas, including Landscape Photography Awarded for his extraordinary accomplishments in Landscape Photography. His work has been exhibited at the Smithsonian. Nikonian since 10th Nov 2002Wed 29-May-13 04:13 PM
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#2. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


McAllen, US
          

Thanks for the link Claudia. I didn't get much from that statement other than "We are going forward with the Cloud version" and "We are looking at more options for photographers and photo-enthusiasts". I think they are convinced that this is the way to go and they are just trying to do some damage control in the interim. I'm not hopeful at this point that the desktop version of CS6 will ever be updated.

Ernesto Santos
esartprints.com Ernesto Santos Photography

  

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ClickCardo Silver Member Nikonian since 23rd Dec 2005Wed 12-Jun-13 04:32 PM
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#41. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 2


Upstate, US
          


I see it exactly the same Ernesto.
Richard


>Thanks for the link Claudia. I didn't get much from that
>statement other than "We are going forward with the Cloud
>version" and "We are looking at more options for
>photographers and photo-enthusiasts". I think they are
>convinced that this is the way to go and they are just trying
>to do some damage control in the interim. I'm not hopeful at
>this point that the desktop version of CS6 will ever be
>updated.


Richard, Win7, OS X, D700, Nikon/Sigma glass

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Wed 29-May-13 04:56 PM
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#3. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Thanks for the link and discussion Claudia.

I saw this posted by a member of a Yahoo Group I belong to.

I agree with Ernesto that this amounts to damage control. In fact didn't they attempts this move about a year ago, but back down over the backlash and instead of a Cloud only went with a Retail/Cloud model. So it appears now that they determined that approximately 80% (I believe I have that stat correct) of full Suite users have moved to a Cloud based subscription they are thumbing their nose at us single application users giving us the option of love it or leave it!

As Ernesto, I'm not very hopeful. Presently I am a PS CS3 user. When I bought my D7000 it left me with a decision on obtaining a NEF converter. Being retired on a fixed income I made due with ViewNX2 as a converter handing off TIFF's to PS. But when they cut the price of LR3 just prior to LR4 release I acquired LR3 and used that to hand off TIFF's. I sort of contemplated getting PS CS6 but am now hesitant.

For full Creative Suite users the cloud is a great deal. But for hobbists like myself if I amortized this correctly, it would represent a 33% increase in cost(assumes a full PS purchase with one upgrade cost over 5 years).

Again, being on a fixed income this sort of puts me between a rock and a hard place. I can only hope that they decide to keep PS as a stand alone retail package for that would seem to be the most cost effective option for me. If I'm wrong in my thinking and calculations I would appreciate any alternative and/or corrections.

Pete

Pete

Pete

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RBHJr Registered since 26th Mar 2013Wed 29-May-13 07:47 PM
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#4. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

First of all, thanks for the link. Second, I agree with others that this doesn't so much represent a change of heart as damage control. I read nothing in the statement that would lead me to conclude anything different.

Adobe seems determined to move everyone to CC and I don't think anything short of a total desertion by graphics professionals (which isn't going to happen) will make any difference. They feel that they have all the killer applications in their corner and that everyone will be forced to eventually comply with their marketing schema. Like it or not.

For me personally... as a retiree on a fixed income, it means that the full version of Photoshop is off the table. I can't afford to add another monthly bill to the pile I pay already. Also, once they have everyone moved to a subscription model, they can pretty much raise prices at will. You don't like it? Too bad.

Currently, I get by with Elements and Lightroom (which I'm just now starting to learn). If and when they go away (or to CC) I'll do something else.

--Ron

  

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OldCodger Registered since 15th Oct 2011Wed 29-May-13 09:23 PM
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#5. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 4


Sawbridgeworth Hertfordshire, GB
          

As yet another retired member drawing pension for the past too many years, I share the grief of others at the thought of a subscription framework. I am still getting to grips with Lightroom 4, one minute it is wonderful the next it's $%^&"£.
I wonder about moving to second stage post processing package other than the six year old one I am using, but would it now be wise to aspire to an Adobe package? I need the certainty of a purchase model with an option of upgrades if needed, if capacity and if funds allow. This pretty much rules out rigid subscriptions. I may have months when other demands compel me to concentrate on health, support of family members older and now younger and much younger, not the business model of a company clearly chasing the money rich few. The web link was interesting, but sadly told me nothing that confirmed hope.

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Thu 30-May-13 12:26 AM
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#6. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


San Jose, US
          

Claudia:

I am with most others and see this as damage control. But I do think that they realize that they will lose potential converts if they don't allow you to access your images if you stop the subscription. I also think that CS6 will be available as a boxed set for sometime in the future, but don't think that will be forever. I own the CS6 Production Premium Suite and while I have purchased updates since CS, I have no intention to join the Cloud. My post processing starts with CNX2 and therefore I never use ACR, so my CS6 SW will last as long as I want to use it, with no need to upgrade. I am only using it for things I can't do in CNX2 which is not much. Like the others I too am retired, but I could swing the cost if I thought it was worth the increase to me, but I don't. I will also most likely kill my NAPP membership as I mainly kept it because of the discounts I got on Adobe products each time I upgraded. I suspect they will move their focus to CC and since I will not I doubt that will be of value to me in the future either. I have used PS for years and I don't feel a need to be trained on the current product. So I still think Adobe will move on and those who are not Pro's will have to look elsewhere if you really think sticking with CS6 will not work for you.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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danshep Silver Member Charter MemberThu 30-May-13 03:25 AM
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#8. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Olympia, US
          


If they do go with subscription, I will not hesitate to abandon them.

But there are so many other options; which one to go with?

My system is an iMac-based one, so perhaps I will check out Aperture.

Of course there's the Nikon route. Somebody could easily step up to the plate, beef up their program, and have a program which could replace Adobe.



"Today is the tomorrow that yesterday you spent money like there was no"

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mad_benny Registered since 06th Apr 2011Thu 30-May-13 03:26 AM
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#9. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Ringwood, AU
          

I think that many people are like myself, happy for some stuff to be in The Cloud, but I have so many photos that I don't want my collection stored on someone elses servers, nor do I want my software in The Cloud. The costs of Terabites of storage in The Cloud can be expensive, or do Adobe intend to provide an unlimited Cloud storage site for all its customers? That would make the price more attractive

Cheers
John Wayman

  

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cogrady Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Jan 2009Thu 30-May-13 01:51 PM
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#10. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 9


Salt Lake City, US
          

John,

I for one don't want any of my images stored in the Cloud. I want them all accessible to me at any time, even if I cancel my subscription to the CC. Hard drive storage is relatively cheap these days.

I guess I'm outnumbered here by those who think this is merely damage control. You all might be right :/ I suppose I just always want to hope that reasonable thinking prevails, but I know it will come down to an easy equation for Adobe: how will they make more money.

Claudia


Visit my Nikonians gallery.


www.one-eye-closed.com
www.lastlightphotographicstudios.com

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RBHJr Registered since 26th Mar 2013Thu 30-May-13 03:21 PM
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#11. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 10


US
          

>I for one don't want any of my images stored in the Cloud. I
>want them all accessible to me at any time, even if I cancel
>my subscription to the CC. Hard drive storage is relatively
>cheap these days.

That's another reason why I'm not keen with jumping on the cloud. I want my images local.

>I guess I'm outnumbered here by those who think this is merely
>damage control. You all might be right :/ I suppose I just
>always want to hope that reasonable thinking prevails, but I
>know it will come down to an easy equation for Adobe: how
>will they make more money.

I would like to see Adobe do something positive on this front as well. I read over the statement several times and with each reading I got the same impression. Hopefully, we're all wrong and Adobe decides to continue to sell and update* a non-subscription version of Photoshop. But, I'm not holding my breath.

--Ron

* For the record I've heard that they plan to sell CS6 indefinitely but have no plans to update it.

  

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quenton8 Silver Member Awarded for bringing his experience to the Nikonians community helping members with printing and the use of post-processing software from the perspective of an IT professional. Nikonian since 11th Apr 2010Thu 30-May-13 06:53 PM
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#12. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 11
Thu 30-May-13 06:54 PM by quenton8

Toronto, CA
          

I wonder where this idea of storing your images in the cloud came from?? Yes adobe, and others, provide a small amount of cloud storage which you can use for whatever if and when you want to.

This has nothing to do with the CC version of Photoshop -- other than adobe tossed in some central storage, which you MIGHT use if you want a few jpegs available on your PC, your laptop, your ipad etc.

Again, nothing to do with how or where you would store your main images for use with Photoshop (or LR etc etc).

Neither are the apps in the "cloud".

In fact "cloud" is marketing gimmick which adobe probably thought might win them some points (seems to have backfired). There is no "cloud" in its normally understood "IT" meaning, at all!!!

The only changes between CS6 and CC are

  • you pay monthly
  • you get updates throughout the year (new feature updates) instead of just when a new version comes out

So try and think of it not as a "cloud" application, but just a "dynamic updating application".

Everything!!, the application, your image files, are on your PC just as before.

----
Dennis Smith.

  

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esantos Moderator Nikonians Resources Writer. Recognized for his outstanding reviews on printers and printing articles. Awarded for his high level of expertise in various areas, including Landscape Photography Awarded for his extraordinary accomplishments in Landscape Photography. His work has been exhibited at the Smithsonian. Nikonian since 10th Nov 2002Thu 30-May-13 07:35 PM
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#13. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 12


McAllen, US
          

Dennis,

Yes, you are correct. Somehow folks started thinking you must save/store your images in the cloud. Not true, it is simply an option. To expand on your explanation, when you subscribe to the Cloud version you download the applications using the Adobe Application Manager. You then install the programs like you would normally. Since I am associated with a non-profit we have purchased several licenses under the Adobe program for non-profit organizations. From what I understand the delivery system we use with our non-profit versions is very much like the Cloud delivery system. It is efficient and works well, but if you do not have a high-speed connection I can imagine you would have a long wait and possibly problems with time outs and possible packet corruption. I have not experienced this personally, but it just stands to reason that this would be an issue on a dial-up account.

These programs will run off of your hard drive like always. The difference is that the program periodically calls home via your internet connection to verify that you are a currently subscribed user. If you have let your subscription lapse you are prompted to renew. If you do not renew the program is rendered inoperable.

The other difference is that Adobe has publicly announced that at some point they will stop supporting CS6 with program enhancements. Updates concerning functionality and security fixes will continue until Adobe deems the program obsolete/discontinued. Not sure when that is scheduled to happen but I would assume that when the next full version is released it will be Cloud based only and then you must subscribe or find a competing product.

Ernesto Santos
esartprints.com Ernesto Santos Photography

  

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RBHJr Registered since 26th Mar 2013Thu 30-May-13 08:02 PM
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#15. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 12


US
          

Actually, Adobe has indicated that they have plans to use their own cloud based hardware to boost the processing power for some versions of their software. I believe a pad version of Photoshop is in the works that would offload much of the processing to Adobe servers.

In any case, I've also seen that they have plans to distribute tools that will allow users to access their images should they unsubscribe from the Creative Cloud at some point.

There is more about both of these things here.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-57586521-92/dislike-adobes-creative-cloud-subscriptions-tough-beans/

--Ron

  

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cogrady Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Jan 2009Fri 31-May-13 12:08 AM
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#16. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 12


Salt Lake City, US
          

Dennis,

Agreed. I didn't mean to imply that and was merely responding to the earlier post. In fact I DO subscribe to the CC and all my images are stored locally. Adobe offers the ability to store a limited amount of file data on the Cloud but it's actually a bit clumsy.

The software all runs locally. No cloud application at all.

Claudia

Visit my Nikonians gallery.


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www.lastlightphotographicstudios.com

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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byomtov Silver Member Nikonian since 30th Mar 2010Mon 10-Jun-13 07:11 PM
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#32. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 10


US
          

My read is that they are not backing off the subscription pricing, but are backing off the idea that if you cancel you lose access to the work you've done with post-CS6 versions.

That seems to me to be a major problem over and above the pricing issue.

The subscription pricing is probably inevitable. Being in the software business (small company, nothing to do with Adobe or photography) myself I can tell you that investors are increasingly looking for, and paying up for, companies that have recurring income streams, especially from "SaaS," (Software as a Service). I have little doubt that Adobe's move is caused by that rather than by any desire to serve customers better, etc.

Still, they are hearing complaints about the cutoff. Very likely they are prepared to lose customers who can't handle the monthly fee - they probably took that into account - but don't want to lose those who can but don't like the rest of the deal.

A big factor is that they don't look trustworthy. They can raise the subscription price any time and you either pay or lose tons of work. And how do we know the same thing won't happen to LR? And what about their push to make DNG a standard?

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Visit my Nikonians gallery.

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Rob_ZN Gold Member Nikonian since 23rd Dec 2012Thu 30-May-13 07:43 PM
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#14. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Durban, ZA
          

I read through the statement and it doesn't seem, to me, that they're back-pedalling at all.
It's more like they're re-affirming their intention to go ahead with the cloud/subscription model despite all the protest.

Reading through it I understand that they may be looking at an offering catering for photographers - so something between the single app and full subscription and they may have a "tool" in the pipeline that would allow access to Adobe proprietary file formats outside of the subscription. That may end up just being something that could convert those files to something usable in other applications.

I say lets wait and see what they come up with, but I doubt retail versions of applications will be it.


Rob

  

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JECoutre Silver Member Nikonian since 02nd Jan 2008Mon 03-Jun-13 01:20 PM
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#17. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon 03-Jun-13 02:31 PM by JECoutre

Concord, US
          

We are indeed an aging society with many of us already on fixed income unable to afford a monthly subscription and do not need access to all the content available in Creative Cloud … we are a growing market place, both as photographers and retirees! Yet we wish to be creative with Photoshop (Lightroom is not adequate in itself, IMO) and need to have the bug fixes and camera specific ACR support. Photoshop CS6 is one solution we should articulate and Adobe should be unambiguous about its continued support.

On another forum of wedding photographers, an on-line petition garnering more than 25,000 signatures to Adobe expressed displeasure with the subscription model. Even a large number of those photographers can’t afford the subscription rate and do not have need for all the content within their business profitability.

Has anyone found an appropriate on-line petition seeking to generate tens of thousands of signatures of those that will leave Adobe unless they meet our needs too?

I want to believe Adobe might listen to customers if enough of us speak up to them or be replaced by new leaders wishing to meet photographers’ needs, IMO.

  

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PSAGuy Silver Member Nikonian since 04th Nov 2008Mon 03-Jun-13 01:56 PM
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#18. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Lake Elmo, US
          

Don't buy it.....I have been in the corporate world for over 38 years and I know "corporate-speak" when I hear it. This will still happen. They have way too much invested in it to turn back now. Look for them to proceed with this, but allow some to continue to buy older products (like CS5 or CS6 for example) on CD.
New products will be cloud based.

BOOK IT !

  

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OldCodger Registered since 15th Oct 2011Mon 03-Jun-13 03:19 PM
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#19. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 18


Sawbridgeworth Hertfordshire, GB
          

Re Post 18, PSAGuy, I agree with you they do have too much of their corporate psyche invested in this fiasco, (as many of us see the plot). The problem is that there are two types of buyers, compelled and optional. By definition the compelled will always buy, but the 'optionals' are often where the margin is made and they are less likely to move with these expensive times. I suspect that the most the 'optionals' can expect is a reduced functionality package at a near full fat, one off price. It will likely be stuffed full of, subscribe to do what you want/need to do.
It may well be the chance for others to mop up those 'optionals' from the market with a keenly priced package that comes with 'buy once' extra cost options.
Richard

  

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quenton8 Silver Member Awarded for bringing his experience to the Nikonians community helping members with printing and the use of post-processing software from the perspective of an IT professional. Nikonian since 11th Apr 2010Mon 03-Jun-13 05:27 PM
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#20. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 19


Toronto, CA
          

I don't see this as a "plot" or just a way to "gouge" users.

For people who update regularly and who need the extended CS, its not a bad deal financially and it provides on-going updates instead of just updates over 2 years.

So changes get to the users faster, adobe has a more consistent and predictable income (working in a S/W company for 30 years, this can be a serious problem).

The issue "I" see is for those on fixed incomes, or incomes not related to photography, and if Adobe can come up with something for us (I am in that group), for say $10 a month, I have no problem with it.

----
Dennis Smith.

  

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OldCodger Registered since 15th Oct 2011Mon 03-Jun-13 05:51 PM
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#21. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 20


Sawbridgeworth Hertfordshire, GB
          

Whatever way you refer to the 'venture', I used plot and fiasco to reflect the level of unhappiness I saw on this site, it does not reduce the hostile responses I saw. I do note that you recognise the split it will create between those who can afford and justify the ongoing cost and those who have no such business case. I called them 'optionals'. My pension is not (yet) entirely fixed, but like those of many others, I face more important demands than feeding the bottom line of optional suppliers. If I have spare cash and an unmet need, I may 'one time' buy, but I cannot and will not sign up to an endless demand.
I accept that as the need for new software tends towards a flatter trend, companies need to modify their business models. I agree that this may provide a more consistent yield, but at a quite possibly smaller market penetration.

  

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JECoutre Silver Member Nikonian since 02nd Jan 2008Mon 03-Jun-13 10:32 PM
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#22. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 21
Mon 03-Jun-13 10:34 PM by JECoutre

Concord, US
          

Don't "accept" this is the way of the furture, it is not UNLESS we allow it. I have been a serial CEO of public and private (venture captital backed) companies for decades before truning full time professional. I assure you that "customers" have a vocie IF they express it loudly and clearly.

Accepting it is a slipery slope! "Assume it as a way of the furture" as neccessary (becasue everybody is doing it) is THE slippery slope!

Send a definitive message loud and clear, just IMO.
Jim

  

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Cookies35 Silver Member Nikonian since 18th Apr 2007Tue 04-Jun-13 12:32 PM
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#23. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


NL
          

Thanks Claudia for posting this link!

What I get from this article is that Adobe "gets it" that there are (at least) two different groups of folks that use their software: graphic designers and photographers.

I took tons and tons of folks a very long time to realize that Photoshop wasn't firstly a program for photographers. That's where all the Photoshop for Photographers books come from. It's still a misconception of tons of folks. When I first started in photography (2008) I purchased Photoshop Elements as a reflex and set about to learning it. Nearly every reference I used started chapter one with "Here's how to open a blank new document."

That alone should have let me know I was starting at the wrong place. For photographers, Step 1 is not opening a blank document.

If Capture NX were as old as Photoshop, I can't imagine that photographers ever would have started using the software in the first place.

But history has us where we are, and the question is whether Adobe is confident enough in Lightroom to lose the lion's share of the purely photographer market to somebody else. Lightroom is amazing in what it does, but unless they basically turn it into Photoshop I can't imagine it'll be enough for those who want "more" than NX or Gimp.

For me the solution seems clear: as they keep developing all the Suite products (now called Cloud products), keep releasing Photoshop annually or bi-annually as a stand-alone for-purchase product as well, just light Lightroom and Elements, and put everything else into the Cloud-Only pot. Problem solved?

— LaDonna

_________________________________
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Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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SteveInReno Registered since 18th May 2013Wed 05-Jun-13 06:33 PM
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#24. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed 05-Jun-13 06:34 PM by SteveInReno

Reno, US
          

I just wanted to add a quick note to those considering the Cloud option. As a quick background, I had the original CC subscription for the first year, for $30/month. It automatically rolled over into the full price of $50/month about 30 days ago. Auto-renewal was on for this account...

Even though this appears to be a month-to-month subscription, it is actually a YEAR LONG COMMITTMENT. Part of their subs agreement says that if you cancel before the committment is over you are charged 50% (yes, FIFTY PERCENT) of the committment price to cancel the subscription.

I'm on with Adobe at this moment trying to cancel my subs, since I'm less that 30 days into the higher-price subscription plan. We'll see how this goes.

Just a heads-up. Be sure to check your renewal dates, and watch your auto-renewal setting if you're close to expiration. I received NO notification of the one-year committment whatsoever when the first year ended, and I'm a little annoyed that I'm fighting with Adobe now to avoid the surprise 50% charge....

Steve

  

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Cookies35 Silver Member Nikonian since 18th Apr 2007Wed 05-Jun-13 09:02 PM
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#25. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 24


NL
          

>Be sure to check your renewal dates, and
>watch your auto-renewal setting if you're close to expiration.
> I received NO notification of the one-year committment
>whatsoever when the first year ended, and I'm a little annoyed
>that I'm fighting with Adobe now to avoid the surprise 50%
>charge....


Thanks for the reminder Steve!

I have the same problem whenever I sign up for an introductory subscription, and then forget to cancel it when the introductory price term is up. That's how I am now subscribed to a full year of Amazon Prime.

But I've got to say this: The after-introduction-period rates I've messed with before never amounted to $50/month. This is the big leagues …

Good luck; I sure hope you get out of it.

— LaDonna

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JECoutre Silver Member Nikonian since 02nd Jan 2008Wed 05-Jun-13 09:47 PM
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#26. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 24
Wed 05-Jun-13 09:51 PM by JECoutre

Concord, US
          

Call your Bank as they will stop the payments in all likelihood. You then get a little leverage and the chance to negotiate the situation without additional payments.

They have one motivation party line from initial customer service reps (else they loose their jobs) which can only be redirected by purchaser responses and in the public eye, IMO. Marketing is always ultimately directed by dollars spent or not spent and competition, IMO. Perhaps too many have already "accepted the inevitable" which it is not, if loud and frequent, votes with thier dollars, IMO.
Jim

  

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quenton8 Silver Member Awarded for bringing his experience to the Nikonians community helping members with printing and the use of post-processing software from the perspective of an IT professional. Nikonian since 11th Apr 2010Sat 08-Jun-13 03:15 PM
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#27. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 26
Sat 08-Jun-13 03:16 PM by quenton8

Toronto, CA
          

Here is an interesting note from an Adobe forum ... (or did I miss this in the discussion?) ...

Q. Will Lightroom 5 be included as part of Adobe Creative Cloud?

A. Yes. Lightroom 5 will be delivered to Creative Cloud members at no extra charge when it’s available.

It went on to say it would continue to be available standalone too.

So does that mean if I play my $20 a month I get not only CSn but LRn? That would make it a slightly better deal.

----
Dennis Smith.

  

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Cookies35 Silver Member Nikonian since 18th Apr 2007Sat 08-Jun-13 03:46 PM
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#28. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 27


NL
          

>So does that mean if I play my $20 a month I get not only CSn
>but LRn? That would make it a slightly better deal.


I think the $20 is for one application only. I think you'd have to pay at least another $20 to get Lightroom.

— LaDonna

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KellyZ Silver Member Nikonian since 01st Mar 2013Mon 10-Jun-13 11:51 AM
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#29. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Levant, US
          

Just had an update to CS6 and Camera Raw 8.1.

I have updates set to notify me.

Just in case anyone missed these before they stop updating.

  

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HHargitt Silver Member Nikonian since 19th Jan 2010Mon 10-Jun-13 06:20 PM
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#30. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 0


Maple Ridge, CA
          

I wonder how much of this cloud push is spurred by Google's purchase of Nic Software and the announcement on Gimp's homepage that they have been accepted to participate in the Google Summer of Code Program 2013? I don't care how many promises Adobe reps make, I'm not going to work in an environment that can hold the work hostage. I keep hearing from them that all will be good... the software will keep working... just subscribe and life will be great... more and more talking to Adobe customer service is like talking to the rep's that used to sell vacation time shares... 'just send money and your life will never be the same.' Now with the brass at Adobe promising only display and printing access, I'm betting that if you want to resize or turn a layer on or off you'll be in trouble.

Oh, and the reason I was on the Gimp homepage... well let's just say I'm checking out my options before Adobe gets any more money.

Happy shooting,

Howard

Will shoot for fame...fun...food... a heck I'll shoot anytime anywhere.

  

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Cookies35 Silver Member Nikonian since 18th Apr 2007Mon 10-Jun-13 07:00 PM
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#31. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 30


NL
          

>I wonder how much of this cloud push is spurred by Google's
>purchase of Nic Software and the announcement on Gimp's
>homepage that they have been accepted to participate in the
>Google Summer of Code Program 2013?

I don't understand the connection. Could you explain this comment further?


>more and more talking to Adobe customer service is like talking to the
>rep's that used to sell vacation time shares...

Except that with Time Share reps you at least get a free set of luggage out of it, or at the very least a free buffet lunch …

— LaDonna

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HHargitt Silver Member Nikonian since 19th Jan 2010Tue 11-Jun-13 12:15 AM
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#33. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 31


Maple Ridge, CA
          

It's just that Google buys a premier plugin company and slashes their prices, then funds a summer programming project to update an open source graphics editor. I was just wondering if it's true that 80% of the people using Photoshop only use 20% of the features, then how much of Adobe's user base would be good with a free alternative. Then add in Nic's plugins for a one time $150, Adobe may need the power of holding all the work that I have done for ransom. Ie. pay us to keep working with your finished images, rather than keeping an older version of the software and moving to a new software. Just over a year ago I switched to Adobe products from Nikon's Capture NX2, that would would have been much harder if I would have had to keep paying Nikon to access all the images I had finished using their software. As it sits now, the switch back is free, as CNX2 hasn't been updated. It looks like going ahead for the next little while will cost $79 to update Lightroom and ride my current Photoshop into the ground, or long term, buying into the cloud and be trapped paying who knows what in Adobe ransom. I'm weighing all my options before I lock myself in and am wondering how many others are going to switch to the cloud or away to something else.

You are so right about the timeshare reps, I'd forgotten about all the freebies... Good thing Adobe didn't offer free luggage... I might have been all packed up and at the airport with no destination and 3 seats in the Cloud... lol

The only question I need answered is will my software keep working without a data link to the mothership...

Happy shooting,

Howard

Will shoot for fame...fun...food... a heck I'll shoot anytime anywhere.

  

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SteveInReno Registered since 18th May 2013Tue 11-Jun-13 05:10 PM
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#34. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 33


Reno, US
          

The one thing that really bothers me about the whole Adobe Cloud thing is whether they'll do to Lightroom what they've done to the rest of the Suite. I have two stand-alone Lightroom licenses, and if Adobe chooses to go the cloud route for Lightroom that will decide the matter for me: I'll go Aperture. I won't be victim to any hostage holding of *my* copyrighted property, and that will just seal the deal for me. Much of what I use PS for can be replicated in other software (such as OnOne's Perfect Photo Suite; awesome software), so I think I easily fall into the "I use PS but only for a SMALL percentage of the features" camp, and I can easily stop using it if there's a shift in the wind at Adobe.

I know it's not on-topic for this thread, but swap one jailor for another? I wonder if there are any other viable options for RAW Asset Management than just LR and Aperture at the moment...

  

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quenton8 Silver Member Awarded for bringing his experience to the Nikonians community helping members with printing and the use of post-processing software from the perspective of an IT professional. Nikonian since 11th Apr 2010Tue 11-Jun-13 05:19 PM
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#35. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 34


Toronto, CA
          

They have said in more than one place that LR will always be available standalone.

A pretty firm but someone too broad a statement -- maybe 20 years from now there will be NO home or office PC's at all anywhere.

But it does show a desire to satisfy the photographic community.

----
Dennis Smith.

  

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byomtov Silver Member Nikonian since 30th Mar 2010Tue 11-Jun-13 05:45 PM
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#36. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 35


US
          

Sure, they've said it. But companies change their policies all the time. Are you going to sue?

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Cookies35 Silver Member Nikonian since 18th Apr 2007Tue 11-Jun-13 07:37 PM
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#37. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 34


NL
          

>I know it's not on-topic for this thread, but swap one jailor
>for another? I wonder if there are any other viable options
>for RAW Asset Management than just LR and Aperture at the
>moment...


The makers of Photo Mechanic has been saying for quite a while that they'll add a catalog feature. If they happen to release that version this summer, I bet a heck of a lot of Adobe users wave Adobe bye-bye.

In the meantime I use it anyway. I really like how well it plays with the other programs I use. Depending on what you mean by "viable," and for that matter "Asset Management," and what your workflow needs are, it might be worth trying.

— LaDonna

_________________________________
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Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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platinumjstrain Silver Member Nikonian since 24th Apr 2007Wed 12-Jun-13 01:42 AM
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#38. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 37


Indianapolis, US
          

Well, I just went through a very frustrating chat with an Adobe representative. I was trying to update to LR 5 and instead I got intercepted by this representative who was unwilling to let me go forward without going through his Creative Cloud spiel. Like many others on this forum, I am about to be retired and on a fixed income. What I neither want nor need is a subscription based service with a high likelihood of the price rising, and being stuck in that system. Even when he relented and offered to send me to the download link, that did not happen and now I am simply frustrated with Adobe. When y'all figure out a good alternative, please post it and away I will go.

  

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JECoutre Silver Member Nikonian since 02nd Jan 2008Wed 12-Jun-13 02:03 AM
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#39. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 38
Wed 12-Jun-13 02:04 AM by JECoutre

Concord, US
          

Here is the direct link to the Adobe site for purchasing Lightroom 5 full version or upgrade version. http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop-lightroom.html?promoid=KAUCD

I agree with you about Adobe's behavior and greed relative to an installed user base that neither can use, need , or afford their subscription model especially fixed income, hobyists, and professionals with very thin margins.
Jim

  

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quenton8 Silver Member Awarded for bringing his experience to the Nikonians community helping members with printing and the use of post-processing software from the perspective of an IT professional. Nikonian since 11th Apr 2010Wed 12-Jun-13 03:31 AM
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#40. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 38
Wed 12-Jun-13 03:32 AM by quenton8

Toronto, CA
          

>Well, I just went through a very frustrating chat with an
>Adobe representative. I was trying to update to LR 5 and
>instead I got intercepted by this representative who was
>unwilling to let me go forward without going through his
>Creative Cloud spiel. Like many others on this forum, I am
>about to be retired and on a fixed income. What I neither want
>nor need is a subscription based service with a high
>likelihood of the price rising, and being stuck in that
>system. Even when he relented and offered to send me to the
>download link, that did not happen and now I am simply
>frustrated with Adobe. When y'all figure out a good
>alternative, please post it and away I will go.
>
>

I assume you got a chat popup -- I always close those, pretty much without a second thought.

I found the purchase and download of LR5 to pretty simple, the chat popup having been ignored

I agree that the $19.99 a month for CSx is more than we might pay if just buying the upgrades, it remains to be seen if ...
- they come up with a nicer price for photographers
- they come up with a nice CSx/LRx bundle via CC, right now you have to pay the full amount to get LR bundled

For LR5 alone though, I cannot complain at the $79 upgrade price.

----
Dennis Smith.

  

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platinumjstrain Silver Member Nikonian since 24th Apr 2007Wed 12-Jun-13 07:48 PM
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#42. "RE: Adobe backing off subscription-only model?"
In response to Reply # 40


Indianapolis, US
          

Yup. Normally I close them too, but for some reason I had the MAC circle of death as I was waiting to go the cart. I foolishly thought this person could help. I certainly did not expect the sales chat I received so I decided to let him know how one of Adobe's real consumers feels about the subscription policy. And, like you, I cannot complain about the $79 upgrade price.

Jim

  

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