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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 30-Sep-13 05:02 PM
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"D5100 image definition "


IN
          

HI EVERYONE...

I am too disappointed.

I got new D5100 + 18-55VR Kit and before I ship it back to wherever it came from (purchased in India) and never buy a piece of Nikon plastic again -- please -- tell me should I try something more, maybe I'm just dull.

I'm talking about NEF, but none of the image host services supports NEF so I am uploading 2 of what is supposed to be the jpeg fine, without any processing - mind you - there is NO difference to NEF anyway!!

Camera settings are all flat, standard, no processing. White balance is mostly on automatic or sunny (btw. any ideas how to set up WB manually???)

NOTES:
Before there was a sound, like additional 'click' just 1 sec after shutter is released, and now that sound has disappeared (??)
(Now it doesn't even save jpeg+NEF but when this option is chosen I get only jpeg+jpeg of the same size - ??? - but never mind that now)

BRIEFLY:
Images have terribly low definition on the edges and overall. None of the images has any focus at all and when you zoom only up to 100% it makes me just cry. But it is not like a simple out-of-focus problem as the guys in ''Nikon service'' (India) tried to convince me.
It is whether:

a)production error
b)camera just sucks
c)black market
d)or I don't get something.


ANY ADVICE??

http://i611.photobucket.com/albums/tt196/trlababalan/_DSC0096.jpg

http://i611.photobucket.com/albums/tt196/trlababalan/_DSC0035.jpg

  

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aolander Silver Member
30th Sep 2013
1
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Semra
30th Sep 2013
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aolander Silver Member
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Semra
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aolander Silver Member
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Semra
30th Sep 2013
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buffumjr
15th Oct 2013
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pjonesCET Gold Member
15th Oct 2013
8
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buffumjr
15th Oct 2013
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pjonesCET Gold Member
17th Oct 2013
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elec164 Silver Member
17th Oct 2013
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buffumjr
19th Oct 2013
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elec164 Silver Member
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Semra
20th Oct 2013
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20th Oct 2013
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21st Oct 2013
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22nd Oct 2013
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23rd Oct 2013
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24th Oct 2013
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aolander Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Sep 2006Mon 30-Sep-13 08:28 PM
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#1. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 0


Nevis, US
          

What shutter speed and aperture are you using? Are you using a tripod or hand-holding? Hand-holding at slowish shutter speeds will cause motion blur. The stick in the boy's hand has motion blur.

Alan

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 30-Sep-13 08:45 PM
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#2. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 1


IN
          

Thanx Alan!

This particular one: 125 / f9 / ISO 100

House, trees and the rest don't have the motion blur.

AND it was focused... But to me - it looks utterly BAD

  

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aolander Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Sep 2006Mon 30-Sep-13 09:12 PM
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#3. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 2


Nevis, US
          

The D5100 can produce very nice images to which many can attest. Before you blame the camera, but sure everything is set up for the type of shots you're taking. For images like the examples, perhaps using AF-S with Single Point AF would be the best. Try that and put the camera on a tripod or use a fast shutter speed like 1/500 and see what your results are like.

Alan

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 30-Sep-13 09:17 PM
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#4. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 3


IN
          

Thanks again Alan

AF- S used always.
Tripod tried.
500, 1000 = same problem.

I had cameras before and never had such a bad quality unless it's really 30 or something like that.. I am waiting for the answer from Nikon as well. WISH IT WASN'T CAMERA BECAUSE I AM ON THE TRIP AND I REALLY BADLY NEED IT NOW (( All my Himalaya photos completely SUCK.

  

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aolander Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Sep 2006Mon 30-Sep-13 09:20 PM
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#5. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 4


Nevis, US
          

Do you have another lens you can try? Could be a lens issue.

Alan

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 30-Sep-13 09:23 PM
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#6. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 5


IN
          

Smells like that to me too. I don't have any other lens with me but I'll try to find someone tomorrow. Thanks again!

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Tue 15-Oct-13 12:24 PM
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#7. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 6
Tue 15-Oct-13 12:25 PM by buffumjr

US
          

Try

Meetup.com for camera clubs. Half of the members have Nikon. See if one will let you swap out for a few minutes. Besides, they're good for other advice, classes, and photo tours.

Lens rental. Check your Yellow Pages.

In choosing a camera, I found that every manufacturer occasionally had quality control (QC) issues. If your camera is still under warranty, they may be able to fix it. If purchased from India, well, good luck. I HOPE you retained the receipt. YOU'LL NEED IT. That is the key to your warranty. Same goes for the lens.

Do the elimination check, then check http://www.nikonusa.com/en/Service-And-Support/Service-And-Repair.page

Unlike adjusting Holley Carburetors, the crowbar and the big hammer are not needed, here. (big grin)

  

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pjonesCET Gold Member Nikonian since 11th Jul 2011Tue 15-Oct-13 07:50 PM
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#8. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 7
Tue 15-Oct-13 07:51 PM by pjonesCET

Martinsville, US
          

While it’s a 3200 with the 18-55mm Lens the 18-55 does prety well for me.

This was shot with 18-55Mm on the 3200 Hand held inside.


Photo of my Mother.

This also is take with 18-55 handled on the D3200


Photo of Mums in a Planter out side our kitchen Door

Originals taken NEF (Raw) and processed using Adobe LightRoom 5 which reads NEF just fine on my Mac.

Phillip M Jones, CET
pjonescet@comcast.net
http://www.phillipmjones.net/

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Tue 15-Oct-13 09:32 PM
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#9. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 8


US
          

What he is talking about could be anything. What your camera and my camera do his may not be doing. It could be technique. It could be the lens. It could be in the camera body. It could be anything. You could have a gremlin.

Remember what I said about the QC issues? Sometimes a manufacturer will dump his QC rejects off to a 3d world reseller. Just so the manufacturing costs aren't totally lost. The 3d world reseller then dumps them to the public at a PROFOUND discount, and lets the manufacturer's warranty department worry about them. He then goes out of business per plan, so he can't be dinged. The next week, he opens a new business. As half of buyers don't keep their paperwork, it's a good business risk. The manufacturer then actually looks good by jumping vigorously to fix problems that shouldn't be there in the first place.

Get thee to your brick and mortar store and have them just look at it. Even if you spend $25 for the service, isn't peace of mind worth that?

Unlike fine wine, this does not improve with age. I don't know when you bot the thing, but the clock is ticking. Deal with it tomorrow at the latest. When the warranty expires, it expires. No arguments.

  

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pjonesCET Gold Member Nikonian since 11th Jul 2011Thu 17-Oct-13 03:11 AM
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#10. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 9


Martinsville, US
          

Exactly just pointing out a good camera or lens can do.

May be he should post samples so some us can help figure whether to send back or do some practicing.

Phillip M Jones, CET
pjonescet@comcast.net
http://www.phillipmjones.net/

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Thu 17-Oct-13 04:18 PM
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#11. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 0
Thu 17-Oct-13 04:18 PM by elec164

US
          

After a careful study of your sample images and the EXIF data, I would tend to believe it’s a combination of a/production error and d/or I don’t get something.

There are multiple questionable areas of your post, so I’ll try and get through them in as coherent manner as possible.

First, you have the color space as AdobeRGB. That’s not a safe choice for web hosting in that many applications are not color managed.

Also you state “when you zoom only up to 100%”. ONLY to 100%!!! Having a 16MP camera myself I can firmly state that one must be cautious when evaluating images at 100% view in an editor on a computer monitor. That 100% view is equivalent to looking at a door sized print at abnormally close viewing distance. At that viewing distance and magnification anything other than the actual focal plane might look soft (DOF is a function of viewing distance and magnification).

Also you say “always AF-S” but the EXIF data begs to differ in that it suggests AF-A was used. That in itself is not necessarily bad, but could be. But I must ask for clarification in that there is a difference between single point AF and AF-S. Your house image in PhotoMe shows only one focus point, but the mushroom image shows two (top of the mushroom cap and the dirt just above it). That suggest that you may have set Dynamic-Area AF for at least the one shot allowing the camera to decide where it thinks the subject is.

Also with the mushroom image it appears you shot it wide open at close range. That provides a very narrow DOF and it appears the camera chose the dirt as the focal plane placing the mushroom (what appears to be the subject) out of focus. In close up shots such as this, I find manual focus to be a better option than AF. Also a tripod is helpful because with a narrow DOF such as this, any slight forward or backward movement on your part with a focus lock will alter what is in focus. So while you may originally focus locked on the mushroom, it appears you may have swayed backward because the dirt in front looks more in focus than anything else (either that or the lens front focused).

Also with the mushroom image it appears to me to have some motion blur (using PS Smartsharpen motion blur option cleans the image up nicely).

As to the house image, while the shutter speed is sufficient for the focal length used to prevent camera motion blur, it appears to be insufficient for subject motion blur as pointed out by Alan.

Also in regard to motion blur, being that VR was active for both shots it begs to ask, was enough time allowed for the VR to settle when taking the shot?

Another point is sharpening. The house image stipulates in the EXIF a setting of 4. I find with my D7000, in general if I want acceptably sharp JEPG’s I need a setting of 7. Also the mushroom image indicates Auto for the sharpening which again allows the camera to decide what is appropriate. Having said all that, I find with sharpening, the detail in the image dictates how much sharpening is needed and no two images might be the same. As such I generally shoot NEF’s and selectively use a 3-step sharpening workflow (input, creative, output).

I’m not saying that there can’t be issues with the camera itself, just that for me with the examples provide, there is sufficient room for pilot error to muddy the waters.

Hope this helps.

Pete

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Sat 19-Oct-13 12:55 AM
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#12. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 11


US
          

WOW! GREAT analysis.

I still like the idea of taking it to a shop with a repairman onsite.

Elec164, in the Exif data, any indication how many shutter releases? Any clue as to how long this has been taking pictures? He won't say.

Again, THE CLOCK IS TICKING! Like taking your dog to the vet, even if it turns out to be NOTHING, at least you did the right thing.

I have heard tales of INSANE expenses for repair, if it's out of warranty.

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Sat 19-Oct-13 02:05 AM
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#13. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 12


US
          


>Elec164, in the Exif data, any indication how many shutter
>releases? Any clue as to how long this has been taking
>pictures? He won't say.
>

Using PhotoME, the EXIF indicates the house image as shutter count 1925 and the mushroom as 1807. So the camera does appear to be lightly used at this point.

Pete

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Sun 20-Oct-13 09:48 AM
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#14. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 12


IN
          

Woo woo woohooo guys!!!

Amazing.
There must have been many gaps in my understanding of digital camera, which I'm about to learn now! - because I printed your posts!
Ssso.. I'm gonna go trough the material today and see what was suggested.

Btw, there are 3 other weird little indications that camera might be sick:
- on the single shot setup, sometimes it just suddenly does continuously 2-3 shots, instead of a single shot;
- instead of RAW+FINE, sometimes it saves only JPEG FINE+JPEG FINE;
- 1 month ago there was a little click just 1,5 sec after the shutter is released, like an additional adjustment of something inside. Click. And now that sound is gone. Btw I am she not he! Greetings from Goa & thank you all!! Talk to you soon

PS - I got the camera in May2013 (of course I kept the warranty!)

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Sun 20-Oct-13 12:39 PM
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#15. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 14


US
          

Good! Still under warranty!

I'm going to assume competent inspection/repair facilities are withing reach. All is guess-work until the repairman gets it. At least your cost will be minimal.

See also if you qualify for any kind of extended warranty. When I bot my d5100, I had 60 days, but that was Cameta's program. Different rules may apply, there.

I plan to have my d5100 for many years. I hope you get that out of yours.

India. One of those photographers' dream locations. And you LIVE THERE!

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 21-Oct-13 04:44 AM
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#16. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 15


IN
          

>I'm going to assume competent inspection/repair facilities are
>withing reach.

I am going to assume that you have never been in India! )
I went to ''collection center'' here, in Varanasi. It was traumatic. They are suppose to take it to the nearest service center - I am sure they wouldn't diagnose nothing less than the gremlin.

Same as with nikonusa.com service and support asia bla bla - wrote them 3 times, but nobody ''jumps vigorously'' to solve the problem. No answer. Gremlin.

Thank you for posting photos Phillip! I am just observing them now.

Pete, thanks so much for your time!!! I guess the mushroom image was made on AUTO setting (but cannot technically check it right now). On manual I really never use dynamic area AF, it's too confusing for me. BUT - that explains a lot about the legendary terrible mushroom image!!

Among all the abbreviations in your post, I found 2 things that I actually didn't know about: difference between single AF and AF-S = ??Sharpening 4 and 7 = ?? Hm. But nevermind, I'll find out!

About the other stuff, generally:
-color space adobeRGB - printed out (unprocessed) images look the same (?)
-tried different lens
-switched off VR
-only using manual focus now.

AND WHAT WITH THE SUDDEN CAMERA'S JUMPS TO CONTINUOUS SHOOTING, SAVING FINE INSTEAD OF NEF, ETC?? I am pacifying my dissapointment with the idea of just shipping the camera to Japan headquarters, but afraid it will be same as those emails that the HELPFUL NIKON STAFF NEVER ANSWERED.

Another thing that bothers me is this annoying white balance. Maybe I still didn't figure out how to set it up manually? It just chooses wrongly every time.

There are some of my already old and not spectacular India images made with Nikon D80 here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/semrakikic/

But yes... In India just everything is a photo, everything is already staged like there is a director behind. Last night I saw amazingly creative smartphone/instagram images that one girl did (which made me even more annoyed thinking of my camera).

Greetings ALL

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Mon 21-Oct-13 12:16 PM
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#17. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 16
Mon 21-Oct-13 12:43 PM by buffumjr

US
          

Sounds like the American Wild West. Picturesque and thrilling, but calling for a high degree of self-sufficiency.

Keeping in mind time zones, try calling 1-800-645-6687. You might need a prefix. I've never placed an international call. This will get you Nikon USA Repair.

I did a Google search for Nikon Repair, Goa, India, and found 4. One was
Shop No. 05,
Saraswati Mandir Building,
Opp Titan Showroom,
18th June Road,
Panjim, Goa - 403001
Call: (0832) 2428377, 9822130977

Was that what you were talking about, above?

I remember back in the 1980's, when I was a budding IT pro, trying to reach help for Adaptec hard drive controller products. Phone, no answer, the automated menu from Hell. Surface mail, no answer. Back then, email was new, and if you didn't know the name you needed, you were out of luck. I ended up looking up the name of their CEO in Standard & Poors, and writing him. That got a response, but it was less than helpful. We couldn't move away from Adaptec products, as the alternative was Taiwanese, and didn't even have a phone number. Hadda muddle through. Certainly made me look less than competent.

I hope the phone number works for you. At least they can advise what to do. You could write Makoto Kimura, Chairman of the Board, Shin-Yurakucho Bldg., 12-1, Yurakucho 1-chome, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo 100-8331, Japan. As a last resort, of course.

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Tue 22-Oct-13 04:16 PM
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#18. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 16


US
          

>There are some of my already old and not spectacular India
>images made with Nikon D80

You are quite modest Semra, that's quite an impressive collection of images.

My first DSLR was also a D80, and for me there was bit of an adjustment period when I moved up to the D7000. There has been much discussion about this, but the higher pixel density will show small imperfections that the lower pixel density wouldn't. After adjusting my technique as well as my post processing skills, I find my images some what superior to those created with my beloved D80.

>Among all the abbreviations in your post, I found 2 things
>that I actually didn't know about: difference between single
>AF and AF-S = ??Sharpening 4 and 7 = ??

What I mean is the sharpening setting in the Picture Controls. The default setting from the factory is quite conservative. For JPEG's straight from the camera I find upping the setting to 7 provides a better result. Of course my preferred method is shooting NEF's and using a 3-step sharpening workflow.

Pete

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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buffumjr Registered since 05th Jun 2013Wed 23-Oct-13 01:11 PM
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#19. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 18


US
          

Wow! Thanx. I'm going to play with that sharpening item. I was satisfied with IQ before, but this may be better. I didn't even know about that item!

As I have said, it'll take me years to outgrow this camera. I'll probably still be learning it then. Probably, by the time I outgrow this camera, cell phones and cameras will be part of the mandatory forehead chip implant, and sharing will be instant. Advertisement will be constant, and unavoidable. Remember to chant, "Change is GOOD. Change is GOOD." Ah, the future.

Perhaps Semra would appreciate a little more detail on the 3 step sharpening process.

In addition, there's a post processing ansd workflow area of Nikonians. Lotta good stuff the manual is so unclear about.

Still doesn't deal with the spurious clicks. A friend, back in the 1960's, when we were discussing the old wrecks we used to drive, said he dealt with clicks and squeaks by simply turning up the radio. Me, I regarded that as an excuse to get greasy and use my wrenches.

  

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roffelmau Silver Member Nikonian since 07th Sep 2013Thu 24-Oct-13 01:26 AM
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#22. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 19


DEPEW, US
          

The click 1.5 seconds after the shutter may have been the VR shutting down. I rarely notice it unless I'm carefully listening for it.

If you turn vr on, put the lens to your ear, half press, then let go you should hear a faint click about a second or so later.


As far as multiple shots... I can to Nikon from canon. On my canons there is a very distinct stop feeling at half press. On my D7100 there is no such stop feeling. Took a bit to get used to. I would fire off multiple shots accidentally every so often.

--Andy

--Andy

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Wed 23-Oct-13 06:48 PM
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#20. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 0
Wed 23-Oct-13 07:58 PM by elec164

US
          

>BRIEFLY:
>Images have terribly low definition on the edges and overall.
>None of the images has any focus at all and when you zoom only
>up to 100% it makes me just cry.

>a)production error

Semra, I cannot account for the multiple frame issue, perhaps that is an indicator of camera malfunction, or not.

But quite honestly when I played with your house image in PS, I personally would have been happy to have take that image.

To me the harsh lighting and low sharpening is the main issue.

Rather than hash out with words what may or may not be, I hope you don't mind but I offer my quick and dirty edits.

Your original:




my edit:




Again it's hard to diagnose issues with cameras over the internet, but the two examples you provided seem to indicate pilot error more than camera malfunction.

Hope this helps.

Pete

Edited to add:

I don't know how much this may apply, but thought it note worthy being that the D5100 and D7000 were successive releases.

When I first started using the D7000 I discovered it had a hair trigger shutter button and found myself often firing off multiple frames when attempting to half press (as well as a few other D7000 users). In fact although better at it, at times I still do. That may or may not apply to your situation, but thought it worth mentioning.

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Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)

  

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coolmom42 Silver Member Awarded for her enthusiastic support of the community and exemplifying the Nikonian mission “Share, Learn and Inspire” Nikonian since 30th Nov 2011Sun 24-Nov-13 03:49 PM
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#34. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 20


McEwen, US
          

I think your issues are with your camera settings, specifically not enough sharpening in the jpg output. The harsh light in your house photo is also a problem, but that's not a camera problem. The edited photo above is very good. Any problem fixable in post-processing is not a camera problem.

The focus issues you described sound like the result of a too shallow depth of field.

working on it in Middle TN
Nikon D3100

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DS256 Silver Member Nikonian since 10th Aug 2009Thu 24-Oct-13 12:34 AM
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#21. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 0


CA
          

Sorry you are having problems. I'm on my 3rd Nikon camera and 2nd DLSR which is the D5100 which I'm happy with.

There have been a lot of good advice shared but I wanted to comment on your statement that NEF files are not supported for upload. There is a good reason for that NEF are a RAW file format which all DLSR cameras produce. RAW is designed for being used in a post processing software package like Capture NX 2 from Nikon or one of the Adobe products. Think of RAW as undeveloped film and this post processing allows you to develop them into JPG but with a a lot of controls over processing. When you select JPG in the camera, it's applying automatic processing of the RAW that comes off the sensor into JPG.

A suggestion before packing it in is to try some of the recommendations as well as trying some shots just on automatic. If you suspect that your camera has a problem, take it into a camera store. With the LCD screen and magnification feature, they can explore potential problems.

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Thu 24-Oct-13 06:54 AM
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#23. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 21


IN
          

buffumjr thanks for googling it for me, I’ll keep this phone number!! Still afraid to go to the service center here - shipping the whole thing to Japan seems more reasonable right now. Pete, glad you like my photos, but that is a huge compliment you gave me! : )) Hey - I also didn't know that Picture controls have the sub-menus!! Awesome. And of course I don't mind you playing with the image but the result is also ugly in my opinion... I still hope it’s a pilot error though!! But even the best images I’m taking these days make me wanna throw the camera into the Ocean because of its persisting inability to focus even with changes I made, even with really patient manual focusing of stable objects in easy light&settings. Andy - I’m running immediately to check if the click was VR!! Also the multiply shots could be easily what you are saying! BUT – any ideas about the remaining annoyance: camera DEFINITELY doesn't save FINE+NEF but 2 fines only!?
DS256, yes I said that no one hosts NEF files because I was hoping to find some online version of Nikon/Adobe suite that hosts and reproduce the NEFs and I wrote my post in a very upset state of mind, because of this camera, but really last thing necessary is rethinking NEF & JPEG after so many years they've been around. Yes, I am trying all the suggestions, thanks for your suggestion

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Thu 24-Oct-13 02:21 PM
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#24. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 23


US
          


>I don't mind you playing with the image but the result is also
>ugly in my opinion... I still hope it’s a pilot error though!!
>But even the best images I’m taking these days make me wanna
>throw the camera into the Ocean because of its persisting
>inability to focus even with changes I made, even with really
>patient manual focusing of stable objects in easy
>light&settings.

Interesting, but just saying "ugly" doesn't help much. Personally I felt my edits significantly improved the softness issue, but granted there is significant perspective distortion due to camera angle at time of capture. But to me that's not an image breaker.

At this juncture it's time to either do some serious testing or send it away for servicing.

For self testing you can download a resolution chart ( this is the one I use), mount it on a wall and line up the camera so the sensor is parallel to it at about 25x the focal length in distance. You should be using a tripod and remote release to minimize any user induced errors, then fire off a few frames using live view AF then viewfinder AF (live view tends to be slower but more accurate but both AF's should be equally precise). Then analyze the images at 100% view for focus accuracy.

That should help indicate if there is a miscalibration of the phase detection AF.

Of course you can send it off and let them do the testing also.

Once that's out of the way then you can move on to user induced errors.

Pete

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Thu 24-Oct-13 04:49 PM
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#27. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 24


IN
          

CLICK MYSTERY SOLVED: VR.
MY STUPIDITY, MY MISTAKE.

JPEG+JPEG instead of JPEG+NEF is still there.

Talk to you tomorrow about the other posted stuff.

Thanks again for helping me out guys! I don't feel lonely in this Nikon struggle with you! Big love!!

  

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roffelmau Silver Member Nikonian since 07th Sep 2013Thu 24-Oct-13 09:44 PM
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#28. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 27
Thu 24-Oct-13 09:46 PM by roffelmau

DEPEW, US
          

Can you shoot raw only? If you go into the shooting menus and set it to only raw, does it record only raw?

Also, is there a scene mode on a 5100? If you have that selected you can only record jpg no matter what. It may be on the dial or in a menu.

Put it into M mode and see if you get both just to be sure.

Also, if you're used to shooting jpg and having your pics look a certain way, they very well may look awful on a computer screen in unadjusted raw state. There's no processing applied at all. Hence "raw". Just a thought.

--Andy

--Andy

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briantilley Moderator Deep knowledge of bodies and lens; high level photography skills Nikonian since 26th Jan 2003Thu 24-Oct-13 02:55 PM
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#25. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 23


Paignton, GB
          

>And of course I don't mind you playing with the image but the
>result is also ugly in my opinion... I still hope it’s a pilot
>error though!!

The example image you posted looks like a decent shot to me, once it has been processed effectively.

It would be good if you could explain a bit more about wht you feel is wrong with it, and why you feel that Pete's adjustments make it "ugly". To me, the adjustments he made bring out the detail that is obviously present, and give it a good range of tones from dark to light.

We don't have much to go on, but I'm of the opinion that whatever problem exists is much more likely to be due to "pilot error" as you put it - that is, not using the most appropriate camera and lens settings for the type of subject - than it is to be a camera fault.

If we can try to reach some common ground about what you feel the problem to be, then I'm sure between us all we can get you closer to being happy with your images

Brian
Welsh Nikonian

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Thu 24-Oct-13 04:24 PM
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#26. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 23


US
          

>Andy - I’m running immediately to check
>if the click was VR!!

The EXIF of your two examples indicate VR was on.

>inability to focus even with changes I made, even with really
>patient manual focusing of stable objects in easy
>light&settings.

After rethinking this statement, I find it most telling and troubling.

Manual focus is manual focus. If the focus screen is improperly shimmed, it could cause a slight shift in focal plane; but something should appear relatively sharp even at 100% view. Yet you seem to indicate nothing is relatively sharp! Quite puzzling!!

Did you try using live view zoomed in to focus? That would eliminate any viewfinder calibration errors. And someone correct me if I'm wrong but when focusing this way even at 100%view that area should be sharp. If you still think it's not, then perhaps it's an unrealistic expectation on your part.

Again remember, a 16MP image on screen at 100% view is a greater enlargement than a 10MP. For example my screen is 96PPI and the longest side of a 10MP image would be like looking at a 40" print at 18" viewing distance and the 16MP a 51" print. Apparent sharpness is dependent upon amount of enlargement and viewing distance. So what might appear acceptable sharp with the 10MP image may look soft with the 16MP image.

Pete

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Mon 18-Nov-13 10:56 AM
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#29. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 26


IN
          

HI ALL!

Just shortly, I apologize for disappearing for so long after asking so many questions. I am moving around India with bags, changing places, virus attacked my laptop so the Photoshop also doesn't work anymore... etc. So it became difficult to focus on all of your plentiful suggestions. So, briefly, first to Brian:

- pictures look bad to me (and to my sadness, some other people confirmed this notion) that there is something awkward like at least 3 layers of the same photo, or something like a slight 'slide' of the whole thing which makes the soft edge similar to 'unsharp mask' (together with aberration correction kind of thing) effect. Softened edges. No definition. No definition at all in any case.
I don't know, hope this is descriptive enough...

Pete, man, many amazing tips from you!!! I will be able to try them all out in January when I get back home - to download resolution chart etc. Then I will take it to service center also. The fact that 16MP image on screen at 100% view is a greater enlargement than 10MP - was definitely not on my mind!! :-/ Pheww. Also I really hope that saying 'ugly' is not taken personally, it is a matter of taste I guess. It just resulted as too 'crispy' for my taste - but the demented 'unsharp mask' thing is still there.

...

On the other hand, I am getting used to this little piece of plastic, not expecting too much, loving the flip-out screen and playing with long exposures & tripod in the night, so the definition is not THE expectation anymore.

PS - yes it does shoot only raw, but raw+jpeg - NOT. That's what I am doing now, only raw, and without Photoshop is a real pain in the ass. Manual and jpeg+raw is my main choice for many many years.
Scene mode???? Never!

Love

  

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briantilley Moderator Deep knowledge of bodies and lens; high level photography skills Nikonian since 26th Jan 2003Mon 18-Nov-13 11:53 AM
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#30. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 29


Paignton, GB
          

Thanks for the update.

My apologies, but I'm not sure what you're getting at with your remark about an "unsharp mask" appearance - I can't see anything that matches that description, either in your original or in Pete's re-processed version.

Brian
Welsh Nikonian

  

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Tue 19-Nov-13 05:20 AM
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#31. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 30


IN
          

You don't have to apologize for seeing my photo better than it is : )) Leave it.

  

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elec164 Silver Member Nikonian since 15th Jan 2009Tue 19-Nov-13 05:22 PM
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#32. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 29


US
          

> Also I really hope that saying 'ugly' is not
>taken personally, it is a matter of taste I guess. It just
>resulted as too 'crispy' for my taste -

Not at all. Realizing that Nikonians is a Global Community, there will invariably be colloquial differences due to cultural differences.

So when I as a Northearstern Yank see a phrase that seems a bit odd to me, I try and take into account the country of origin of that person and realize that a similar phrase can take on an entirely different meaning!

Hopefully you'll get it all sorted out post haste!

Pete

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Semra Registered since 28th Sep 2013Thu 21-Nov-13 02:16 PM
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#33. "RE: D5100 image definition "
In response to Reply # 32


IN
          

>> colloquial differences

Thank you, Pete. I am not even from English speaking country, so in my languague saying that photo is 'ugly' perhaps has less 'weight'.
Thank you again for all of your tips.

  

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