All images captured with D3 and 16 mm Fisheye lens at F/8.0.
Shutter = 1.0 second, ISO = 200
Interior illumination provided by two Nikon SB-R200 speedlights clamped to handles above rear doors of Chevy Tahoe, and triggered by on-camera SU800, using CLS TTL at +0.7 stops and rear curtain sync.
Camera mounted on small Gitzo CF tripod equipped with RRS ball head, with two legs on rear floor and one on radio console.
All images capture in tethered mode by notebook computer on back seat beside me.

The 16 mm fisheye is the only practical lens for images like this. SB-R200 placement is always a probem as it is almost impossible in most vehicles to avoid shadows and specular bounces from dashboard surfaces.





Image 1: Vehicle moving 15 miles per hour, which equals 22 feet in one second. Notice slight double image of officer on right side of vehicle.
He moved slightly while shuttter was open before speedlights fired. Full frame image in 3:2 aspect ratio.





Image 2: Image 1 above, cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.





Image 3: Moving 15 miles per hour in illuminated tunnel in center of town. Cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.





Image 4: Vehicle stationary at traffic light. Cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.



For those willing to take the time, would you please tell me which images you like, or dislike, and why?
I will be sharing these images with the police officers tonight for their reactions which I will share with you later. Thanks in advance.

Comments and critique welcome as usual.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)
Attachment #3, (jpg file)
Attachment #4, (jpg file)

Great shots! I for one and surprised they are not playing Angry Birds. (Just kidding, of course!)

Image 1: Notice slight double image of officer on right side of vehicle.
He moved slightly while shuttter was open before speedlights fired.

I would not have seen that unless you mentioned it.

Image 2, 5:4 crop. I' don't like this one, its the only one where the officers' heads are cropped out, seems too tight, for me anyways.

I like Images 3 & 4, too. It seems that the handle for the spot light on the driver's side is coming out of the driver's lips, almost as if she is holding something there (like a whistle).

Great shots, I guess I would have to say that #1 is my favorite, more because it includes more of the officers; but #4 is a little more dynamic with the partner more active with the computer.

Anthony

The Moderator Page and My Gallery
The important things in life are simple; the simple things are hard.

>...please tell me which images you like, or dislike, and why?

Tough call! I like the view out the windshield of images 1 and 2, but I like the view of the inside of the vehicle better in 3 and 4. In 3 I like the officer on the right looking more to the front, and in 4 I like that officer's hands on the computer.

All-in-all I think I like 4 best. But with a little Photoshop, you can create what I'd really like to see by moving the hands of the officer in image 4 into image 3, and moving the windshield view of image 1 into image 3. That's not asking too much, is it?

Randy

Hal,
This is a completely different level of photography! Great work my friend.

#1. I like the light trails, overall feel and the easy manner of both the officers. I like relative "softish" look of the (hard) light as well.

#2. Don't like this one!

#3. This is probably my favorite. Crop makes it look bit more closer to the action than the other shots. Converging tunnel and tunnel lights along with the motion blur outside the car, without too many light trails, conveys a sense of movement and direction without too much clutter, and helps to keep the eye on the subjects. Camera/flash position has allowed you to avoid the specular highlight on the rear view mirror that is there on #1 & #2, which is really good.
You can easily pass for a third officer! Or may be clone out the self portrait!

I Personally prefer to see the female officer to be ¹/₂ to 1 stop underexposed.


#4. Just like the #3, but conveys a different feel.

Regards
Dinil



Struck by Light - Blog & Gallery
Visible Range - Photography & Beyond

This is a cool series.

I like #1 the best, followed by #4.

One thing that bothers me a bit is the driver seems to be facing too much to the right. Of course that is the fisheye effect. This is overall minor.

Thanks for sharing,
Peter

Hal,

I like number 1 the best. The slight bluring doesn't bother me. In 3 and 4 the flash seems a little too strong.

Regards,

John

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

#1- Needs to be rotated clockwise. I like the energy from the blurred lights external to the car. Decisive moment on the laptop. Wish she had the mic out of her lap on this one. The fisheye does make it seem like they are cruising in a VW Bug in all the shots, however
#2- Best outside view. Worst inside shot as I don't like the cut off heads.
3#- Love the tunnel. I installed the first video surveillance system down there when it was built in 1990, tube cameras in sealed nitrogen housings. I like seeing the faces again. Don't like the hand position on the laptop, no energy.
4#- Best overall image. Both faces are visible, good action from the officers, exterior scene interesting and well exposed. I think the shadows on their shoulders are the thing that I find distracting.

Nice work, Hal!

Dean
Phoenix, Arizona USA
Nikonians Team Member
Website: The Splendid Silence of Light

Recent Trips: Grand Canyon 2012 Glen Canyon 2012 West Clear Creek

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Hal,

While I tried to envision these when you mentioned them in your other post, I never expected them to come out this wonderful. I particularly like 1, 3, & 4. As others have pointed out the exclusion of the officer's faces in #2 diminishes the overall effect. I think #1 could use just a tad more contrast like you see in #3 & #4.

Once again, great work. I see the first image as a serious contender for use in publicity material for the Department, it just oozes professionalism on your part. Bravo!

Ernesto Santos

esartprints.com Ernesto Santos Photography
Now offering fine art print services and ICC printer profiling.
Great service - at a great price!

I like #1 the most. It's dynamic and there's more of a story in that than in the others. (#2 is dynamic but without the faces is less of a story.)

...Mike

My website | My Nikonians gallery

Anthony, Randy, Dinil, Peter, John, Dean, Ernesto, and Mike:

Thank you all for your comments. I appreciate your insights and different perspectives, which will help me when I make the final selection and PP of the images I will convey to the police department.

A few words about this series:

1) The rear pair of tripod legs on the floor behind the front seats were almost vertical, with the bulk of the D3's weight almost over them. Every time the driver accelerated, the entire rig tried to tip over. If I wasn't constantly holding it down with one hand and shooting with the other it would have tipped.

2) There was almost no freedom for camera placement. Fortunately, the camera lens was far enough forward to eliminate most of the front seat head rests.

3) The only place for the front tripod leg was on a cover of some sort on one of the radio panels in the console. This cover moved slightly from time to time and I failed to notice it. Hence, the slighty out of level framing in some of the images. Image 1) is the full 3:2 aspect ratio frame from the D3. It can be rotated a bit, but will require some cropping to do so.

4) My perch sitting sideways on the front edge of the vinyl covered rear seat was precarious and very slippery. Every time the driver accelerated or started up from a stop, I would slide to the back of the seat and the camera/tripod configuration would try to follow.

5) I initially asked for a pair of officers that were about the same size. No such luck! The driver was consiberably smaller than her partner in the right seat. I finally asked here to move her seat up and as far forwards as it would go. This brought her head up approximately level with his, but now included more of the head rest and seat back to deal with.

6) The pair of SB-R200 speedlights were attached to Manfrotto Super Clamps which were the fastened to the handles over the rear doors. Not the best location, but the only one practical. The right side speedlight was aimed at the left side of the vehicle and the left side speedlight was aimed at the right side of the vehicle. This was the only way to minimize the shadows that were created by the officer's heads.

7) As you can see in these images, the interior of a police car, even the Chevy Tahoe we were in, is very cramped and cluttered with "stuff". My tendency is to shoot it as it exists, doing as much as possible in the camera, and as little as possible in post. In other words, I prefer capturing images as opposed to creating them in post. My philosophy ... others may vary.

8) With a bit of minor PP (rotating, contrast, etc.) and another pass through these images, I suspect we will come up with a few keepers. Some of the images will be used in life-size (two feet wide by six or more feet tall), standup posters placed in city hall and other buildings around town. Some of these will be cropped from landscape images, and others will be shot in portrait mode. Other images will be used in much smaller sizes, less than one inch square and up, including larger versions used in full color tri-fold brochures of various sizes. If we can capture enough images before it gets too hot here in the Sonoran Desert, we will produce another promotional/recruiting calendar, which will require at least fifteen or more landscape images at 11.0 wide by 8.5 inches tall, plus two or three dozen smaller crops used to break up text and fill dead space.

9) When I showed the officers these images last night, they had never seen anything like them and liked all of them. Again, thanks for your more objective assessments.

10) Shots like these are indeed challenging, but the rewards are usually worth the effort and, in this case, the discomfort.

11) Last night was spent driving around on the tarmac, in the giant hangars, and down in the bowels of the massive baggage handling conveyor systems at our large, international airport, scouting locations for two or three nights of shooting. We will likely include a bomb-sniffing K9 dog and handler in several of the images.

Thanks again to all of you. You have been a big help.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

>11) Last night was spent driving around on the tarmac, in the
>giant hangars, and down in the bowels of the massive baggage
>handling conveyor systems at our large, international airport,
>scouting locations for two or three nights of shooting. We
>will likely include a bomb-sniffing K9 dog and handler in
>several of the images.

Interesting new locations!

I would guess one of the biggest challenges I might have in these fascinating scenarios is securing enough time and patience from the models as I fiddle around from inexperience!

Peter

Peter::

You wouldn't have to worry!

Any time two or more police officers are together, they talk incessantly about wages, shifts, rumor mills, department politics, war stories ... it never ends. For large groups I have an amplified bull horn that I use to get their attention for the next shot.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Sorry I missed the suspense date.

I like photo 2 best for the reason you mention above. Patrols always talk and fidget. Seeing their heads without movement looks like a storefront mannequin.

Thanks for the lighting description. How did you keep the flash off the windshield. Or is the glass sloped enough that the reflection goes down? I'm never had good success in a HMMWV where the windshields are flat. I should try adding barn doors to the flash so no light goes direct to the windshield.

I assume the slow speed reduces/eliminates the vibration. A tripod still has vibration (for me) when the vehicle is at full speed.

Daniel McGowan
Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Daniel:



Thank you for joining the discussion. I appreciate your comments.

The SB-R200 speedlights did not create a problem in the windshield for the reason you mentioned: slope of the glass.

When setting up shots like these, I first select the aperture for depth of field, typically F/8.0 to F/11.0, which produces great DoF with a 16 mm fisheye lens. Then I derive the shutter speed (typically one second) required to provide proper exposure for the external lights, vehicle, and buildings. Finally, I select the power level necessary to appropriately illuminate the interior of the vehicle. The small diffusers on the SB-R200s served to bounce the light off the neutral gray ceiling, which acts as a large soft box, without altering the color temperature.

I hold the tripod down with my left hand, while shooting with my right. This essentially "locks" the tripod to the car floor, and the tripod moves as part of the vehicle, thus retaining interior sharpness while the shutter is open. Following earlier testing a few years ago, the one second shutter time was also determined to be the best choice for the motion of the exterior lights at fifteen miles per hour. At that speed, the vehicle travels 22 feet in one second, producing the results seen above.

At faster speeds at one second shutter time, the external light streaks become meaningless blurs. At 30 miles per hour, the car travels 44 feet in one second, 66 feet at 45 miles per hour, and 88 feet at 60 miles per hour. Moving vehicle shots always involve compromise of multipel factors: vehicle speed, ambient (external) illumination, interior illumination, shutter speed, aperture, etc. I always shoot these images at the camera's base ISO, 200 in this case, so that is not an issue.

I encourage you to keep at it, as the rewards are worth the effort. Please let us see some of your work to date. You are the first to indicate that you have tried this type of photography. I am always willing to learn from others.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

>I hold the tripod down with my left hand, while shooting with
>my right. This essentially "locks" the tripod to the
>car floor, and the tripod moves as part of the vehicle, thus
>retaining interior sharpness while the shutter is open.

Interesting. This is a (rare) example of when VR would not be desirable. In this situation we want the camera to following the movement and vibration of the camera support!

(I am ignoring the issue of VR advisability while using a tripod ).

Cheers,
Peter

Thanks for the analysis. That is very helpful. So many photographers say things like, "I selected f/8, blah, blah, blah" without ever saying *why* they used that aperture or what positive (or negative) side effects it had on other variables.

I generally take photos on long road trips like this ice climbing trip to Canada. Motion blur is more pleasant from handholding because the floor vibrates a lot and affects the photo at highway speeds. Vehicles flex a lot so the tripod at those speeds doesn't keep the camera stationary in relation to the interior. Flash is risky on the highway.

I'll try getting them to pull away from the stop lights a bit slower. Your results are better and still tell the movement story.

Edited to correct spilling - I mean spelling.

Daniel McGowan
Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

I've found shooting through a car's windshield can make some interesting images. This one is on a January evening about 6:30 near Columbus, GA.

D300 on a beanbag on the dash connected to a remote release held in my right hand with both hands on the wheel.

2 sec


Enough movement without making total mush.

Mick
www.mickklassphoto.com
or
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Attachment #1, (jpg file)

  

Two things that come to mind:

Did you consider Lightrooms lens correction? Might make the image less distorted.

I would take two Hero Pro2 cameras and point one forward as you did and the other backward from the dash towards you. I have done it before with excellent results. Plus you could time lapse photograph your whole adventure and then choose from many images with great results.

I would also have liked to see the officers in other settings, as one expects the officers to be "action heroes", not just laptop typists. But it is very likely you have other shots to share.

I got the chance to do a "ride along" in TX once, and I encourage all Nikonians to ask to do so at their local PD. An incredible experience not only photographically but also to understand the life and complication of cops, and how our perception of them is so distorted by our biases and preconceptions.

“ Your first 10000 photographs are your worst." – Henri Cartier-Bresson

Miguel:

Thank you for joining this discussion. I appreciate your comments.

This series of shoots will likely total fifteen to twenty individual sessions. Ergo, I will be photographing officers in a variety of tactical settings, from classroom shots of recruits in training, to shots of, and from, helicopters, and everything in between. I will post a few images as things evolve.

Agreed: A ride along with a police officer can be a very informative, educational activity. I also encourage Nikonians to take advantage of such an opportunity if available from your local law enforcement agency.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Yes, my son and I attended a Civilian Police Academy in Forest Park. One evening was a ride along with an officer on his beat. It was very interesting. Wish I had felt comfortable enough to bring my camera.

I got suckered into thinking that was you in the mirror too. I couldn't tell the hair was blond, but it definitely belongs to the driver!

Scott Chapin
Powder Springs, GA, USA
Nikonians Team Member

Daniel and Mick:

Thank you for posting your moving vehicle interior shots. It is nice to see the work of others.

I hope my setup and execution details are complete enough to help you refine your technique.

A question for both of you: How fast were your vehicles moving when you captured these images: a) relative to the ground, and b) relative to the other vehicles?

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal,

Thanks for the detailed blow-by-blow description of the limitations of shooting inside the vehicle. Now that we know the challenge you were facing, we are all even more impressed.

Ernesto Santos

esartprints.com Ernesto Santos Photography
Now offering fine art print services and ICC printer profiling.
Great service - at a great price!

Considering what I've heard about the back seat of police vehicles, I think that might be the scariest part of your adventure.

Mick
www.mickklassphoto.com
or
Visit my nikonians gallery

Ernesto and Mick:

Most police cars are equipped with strong plastic/metal panels separating the front and back seats to protect the officers from unruly "guests" in the back seats. Some of the larger units are also equipped with very uncomfortable, hard shell plastic seats in the rear to facilitate cleaning following the transport of such "guests" that become ill in various ways during the ride.

For photo shoots like these, we always request a vehicle that does not include the protective panel, which would make photography from the back seat impossible. Cramped, uncomfortable, awkward ... yes, but it could be worse.

Thanks to both of you for your comments and encouragement.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal
To me its #4. I like the fact that we see more of the officer on the right and he is more engaged with his work.
The location in the street works for me rather than the tunnel even though the vehicle is stopped here.
The movement in the other 3 is very good. Oh its so hard but I'll stick with #4.
BTW wonderful exposures and color.


Peter
Paynesville, VIC Australia

Diploma of Photo Imaging, 2010.

>BTW wonderful exposures and color.

Yes. Radio displays and computer monitor are not washed out. Windshield has no reflection. Interior of car is lit up so we can see everything (I suppose that isn't what you'd see in real life). Nothing under or overexposed. Peter

Hal,

Impressive, as usual.

I prefer number 1 as well. The implied action and having the officers' faces in the scene make it work. Also, the sides of their faces are not blown out or overly bright as in the last 2.

Mick
www.mickklassphoto.com
or
Visit my nikonians gallery

Hal, my favourite is #1, as it shows both officers and I like the interest on the street ahead of them.

Phil
A Canadian Nikonian
My portfolio: www.pjr99.500px.com

Peter M, Peter S, and Phil:

Thank you for your comments, support and encouraging words. They are a great help to me.

This series is one of the more difficult to pull off. Some upcoming shoots at our airport may present some new, special challenges as well.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal... I was wondering if you have considered a shot that is less upbeat (if that makes any sense). Perhaps the same type of interior shot of the vehicle, but mostly the dashboard, computer, and radio lights visible, faint outline of vehicle interior visible, and officer peering intently off to one side trying to detect and avoid danger, or shining a flashlight off to the other side. The outdoors would be more murky, such as a warehouse district. The feeling would be "stalking". I suppose such a shot doesn't have as much "curb appeal" as it isn't bright and sparkly. Just thinking aloud! Cheers, Peter

Peter:

Thank you for an excellent suggestion. I appreciate your continued interest in this thread. It is very helpful to me.

The primary goal of the above set of images is to obtain a view of the interior of the car while responding to a call for service. Calls for service can originate for several reasons: another officer requesting backup, a citizen calling in for help, traffic events requiring multiple officers, critical incidents involving ahootings and/or serious bodily injury, etc. The driver is in radio contact with dispatch, while the other officer is gathering location and other information about the call. Yes, it is bright and punchy, but that is necessary if it is to make it to a calendar cover or other larger format image while retaining the high image quality, contrast and "Punch".

I have ridden along many times with officers while they are responding to real calls for service. Things can get real interesting in seconds, wihle hurtling down crowded highways at high speeds.

If this were a real call, the interior would be dark with the exception of the instrument panel, radios, and computer illumination. When necessary to read something on paper, they will turn on a red overhead light which provides just enough to read by, but not so much as to destroy their night vision. The last time I shot from the interior like this was for the same department's 2008 calendar cover. We tried various combinations with the red light on and off, and when it is on it casts an unnatural red glow around the interior that does not photograph well.

We plan other shoots around a scene after they arrive at the call for service location, including warehouse districts with K9 dogs and officers, dark alleys, guns drawn, SWAT teams moving in, etc.

I have completed five separate shoots to date, with probably fifteen or more to go. Lots of room for suggestions, so please keep them coming.

Thanks again Peter ... I appreciate your help.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

>Thanks again Peter ... I appreciate your help.

Thanks for sharing such a fascinating and unique photography assignment. Peter

Fascinatingly great!

jdroach, a Milwaukee area and sometimes Chicago area Nikonian.





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John:

Thank you for your kind words. Always as pleasure to hear from you.

You have the famous Miracle Mile there in Chicago, which would be great for a series of night time images like these. Can I entice you into trying it and sharing some of the results with us?

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

HBB,

Someday when I get a fisheye. It is a ways down my list.

John

jdroach, a Milwaukee area and sometimes Chicago area Nikonian.





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My 2 cents (a bit late)

#1 - The officer's faces are not over-exposed, there is occupant interest out the windshield, the officers are included and involved with the movement. Nice work!

KenL

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Hal,

I have had a further thought regarding these images. You said, "The primary goal of the above set of images is to obtain a view of the interior of the car while responding to a call for service." With that in mind, it seems to me that image 1 meets that requirement better than the others because the presence of the black car ahead of the police car stops the eye from following the converging lines off into the distance. I found that my eye comes into the image, rests on the police woman then follows the converging lines in front of the car until I reach the black car. The eye then comes back into the car, picks up the male officer, then the shoulder badges before coming back to the female officer. I also feel that the presence of so many in focus elements in front of the car, coupled with the converging lines, in images 3 and 4 tend to drag the eye out of the car and away from the primary subject.

I am sure we will all be very interested to hear what the officers themselves think.

Regards,

John

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Hal

I am impressed by these images, great job!! kudos!!!

while reading all the comments and your description of this job, as well as the problems encountered, have you tried to place an autopole from manfrotto (or something like that) inside the car, extending from floor to the ceiling and placing the camera in there? this way you will not have the camera moving when the vehicle accelerates or stops and as a plus, you will have both hands free to move around.

As for your images, I prefer number 1, the only thing that really bothers me, is the flash reflection in the rearview mirror, it moves my eye to that spot all the time, I know getting rid of this would be no problem in pp.

as for the rest of the images, they feel too tight, specially the cropped ones.

the shadows in 2,3 and 4 seem too harsh

in number one, I feel that the computer is a little bit over exposed, not sure, as well as the driver as mentioned in another post.

Overall I really think that you are making an excellent job, I dont get to see this much information on a pro photographer very often

congrats.

Humberto´s, proud nikonian in Cancun, Mexico

"The important thing is never to stop questioning."~Albert Einstein

"Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."~Yoda

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Humberto:

Thank you for your comments. I appreciate your insights.

Concerning your perception that the images are "too tight", it was not physically possible to move the camera back any more, without removing the back seat of the vehicle where I was perched. And, moving the camera farther back exposes the head rests on the front seats where the officers were sitting. We tried to remove them, but did not succeed.

Harsh shadows are unavoidable in this setup. The use of soft boxes, even small ones, is impossible given the already cramped working space. I did tilt the SB-R200 speedlights up as much as possible to use the gray ceiling material as a diffuser, which helped a bit.

The other issues you mentioned will be fixed when I get into the detailed post processing. These images are simply a first pass, proof of concept.

I have shot this setup twice now, the last time several years ago, and these images are much better than the previous effort.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hi Hal.

First, brilliantly acomplished. Given the constraints you have produced what I am sure are very usable photos.

I think the interior lighting in the last shot is the best of the four but I think it would be even better with the flashes lowered by 1/2 to 2/3 stop.

The view out the windshield in the first photo perfectly captures the feeling of motion.

Having the right side officer turn to his left as he did really helps in seeing him. The driver could turn a little to her right and move her head away from the spotlight base (she looks like she is smoking a pipe).

Thanks so much for sharing your techniques (both here and elsewhere).


JIM

Jim:

Thank you for joining this discussion. I appreciate your comments.

The balance between interior and exterior illumination is a constantly moving target. As mentioned earlier, shutter speed and aperture are chosen for depth of field, 22 feet of travel at 15 miles per hour, etc. This leaves interior illumination (SB-R200s) as the variable.

Following some testing prior to leaving the department's parking lot and heading out on the road, I selected +0.7 and left it there, which produced a bit of over-exposure at times. I will be adjusting exposure in final pp, either by Exposure in RAW and/or Levels, Shadows/Highlights in PS5.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

>All images captured with D3 and 16 mm Fisheye lens at F/8.0.
>Shutter = 1.0 second, ISO = 200
>Interior illumination provided by two Nikon SB-R200
>speedlights clamped to handles above rear doors of Chevy
>Tahoe, and triggered by on-camera SU800, using CLS TTL at +0.7
>stops and rear curtain sync.
>Camera mounted on small Gitzo CF tripod equipped with RRS ball
>head, with two legs on rear floor and one on radio console.
>All images capture in tethered mode by notebook computer on
>back seat beside me.
>
>The 16 mm fisheye is the only practical lens for images like
>this. SB-R200 placement is always a probem as it is almost
>impossible in most vehicles to avoid shadows and specular
>bounces from dashboard surfaces.
>
>
>
>
>
>Image 1: Vehicle moving 15 miles per hour, which equals 22
>feet in one second. Notice slight double image of officer on
>right side of vehicle.
>He moved slightly while shuttter was open before speedlights
>fired. Full frame image in 3:2 aspect ratio.
>
>
>
>
>
>Image 2: Image 1 above, cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.
>
>
>
>
>
>Image 3: Moving 15 miles per hour in illuminated tunnel in
>center of town. Cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.
>
>
>
>
>
>Image 4: Vehicle stationary at traffic light. Cropped to 5:4
>aspect ratio.
>
>
>
>For those willing to take the time, would you please tell me
>which images you like, or dislike, and why?
>I will be sharing these images with the police officers
>tonight for their reactions which I will share with you later.
> Thanks in advance.
>
>Comments and critique welcome as usual.
>
>Regards,
>
>HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
>Nikonian Team Member
>
> Photography is
>a journey with no conceivable destination.
>

Attachment #1, ( file)

>>All images captured with D3 and 16 mm Fisheye lens at
>F/8.0.
>>Shutter = 1.0 second, ISO = 200
>>Interior illumination provided by two Nikon SB-R200
>>speedlights clamped to handles above rear doors of Chevy
>>Tahoe, and triggered by on-camera SU800, using CLS TTL at
>+0.7
>>stops and rear curtain sync.
>>Camera mounted on small Gitzo CF tripod equipped with RRS
>ball
>>head, with two legs on rear floor and one on radio
>console.
>>All images capture in tethered mode by notebook computer
>on
>>back seat beside me.
>>
>>The 16 mm fisheye is the only practical lens for images
>like
>>this. SB-R200 placement is always a probem as it is
>almost
>>impossible in most vehicles to avoid shadows and specular
>>bounces from dashboard surfaces.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Image 1: Vehicle moving 15 miles per hour, which equals
>22
>>feet in one second. Notice slight double image of officer
>on
>>right side of vehicle.
>>He moved slightly while shuttter was open before
>speedlights
>>fired. Full frame image in 3:2 aspect ratio.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Image 2: Image 1 above, cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Image 3: Moving 15 miles per hour in illuminated tunnel
>in
>>center of town. Cropped to 5:4 aspect ratio.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Image 4: Vehicle stationary at traffic light. Cropped to
>5:4
>>aspect ratio.
>>
>>
>>
>>For those willing to take the time, would you please tell
>me
>>which images you like, or dislike, and why?
>>I will be sharing these images with the police officers
>>tonight for their reactions which I will share with you
>later.
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>>Comments and critique welcome as usual.
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
>>Nikonian Team Member
>>
>>
>Photography is
>>a journey with no conceivable destination.
>>I Like 3rd Image,There is traffic in front of police car and lady ready to do some kind of action with her wireless radio , so lots happening in this small space.It seems you have taken lot of care about details on computer screen data. And there is not much shine on both the faces in the 3rd frame.
RMPANDIT

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Great shots, Hal. Your use of flash in difficult settings is always impressive. I like the second image the best, as it draws my eye to the road ahead rather than the interior of the vehicle.

Rocky

All the images look good. I prefer image #2. Even if their faces are not showing you don't have to see them to know what's going on or were your at. The motion draws you into the image. Good job.

Colleagues:

I apologize for combining my responses to you in a single post. The net is extremely slow today and I am running out of time. Thanks in advance for your understanding.


Rajendra:

Thank you for joining this discussion. Yes, there is a lot going on in the small, cramped space of a patrol car, even a larger one like this one.


Rocky:

Thanks for dropping in. Nice to hear from you again. Yes, this is one of the more challenging uses of speedlights I've encountered in this ongoing law enforcement series. Wednesday night of this week I start several sessions at our local airport. Should be interesting.


Tommy:

Welcome to Nikonians. I hope your time with us will be rewarding. Thanks for you comments about #2. It comes down to the difference between what is going on in the car, and what is going on in front of the car. Two quite different perspectives.


Jay:

Thank you for your comments. I appreciate them. Tell me a bit more about the 15 mm lens. Does is produce circular or rectangular images? Who makes/made it? Are they still available? Is your interior shot available on another site where we can view it? I would like to see it. If not, tell us a bit more about the shot: setup. vehicle, lighting, etc. A Noblex UX Pro 150, 6 x 12 cm frame sounds like a panorama camera, yes? Interesting ...


Regards to all of you for your participation in Nikonians.

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal, Wonderful results you are showing here. In your trials have you considered the 15mm F3.5 lens? I have one but rarely use it. It occurs to me it might be a lens to consider for variations. My efforts at photographing driver and passengers in a car have been with a Noblex UX Pro 150 (6x12cm), so not appropriate to post here.

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Hal, I work for a police association in Canada and of course am intersted in these ride-along photos. Thank you for your tips on techique. Do you think a 14mm lens on full frame would achieve anything close to your results? I would love to pitch a photo shoot like this to our chief. Cheers, Ray

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Ray:

Thank you for joining this discussion. I appreciate your interest.

The diagonal field of view at 14 mm focal length on an FX body is 114 degrees, compared to 180 degrees for the 16 mm fisheye lens. This is a difference of 66 degrees total, or 33 degrees on a side.

If you can move back in the vehicle to include more of the officers in the composition, you quickly find that you are photographing the head rests of the front seats. If the head rests can be removed, that will help a lot, but you are still faced with getting the camera far enough back to acquire the desired composition.

The best suggestion I can offer is to crawl into the back seat of a patrol car with your 14 mm lens and see what happens.

As an alternative, perhaps you can rent a 16 mm fisheye lens.

Let me know if you have anymore questions about the setup and execution of this type of shot.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hello HBB,
Great photos! I particularly like the first photo with rear curtain sync; the motion blur I think, really conveys the subject matter of the photo. I'm very interested in the Nikon CLS system and would like to attend one of the Nikonians workshops on it. I just purchased Mike Hagen's book on it. It seems pretty complicated, so I think a workshop would be a big help. This is my first post as a Nikonian, so I hope I'm doing this response correctly!

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James:

Welcome to Nikonians. I hope you find your time with us rewarding.

Yes, the CLS technology can be intimidating at first. When I started assembling my herd of twelve SB800s several years ago, there was nobody around to ask for help. It took me a couple days almost full time to sort out the various modes, configuration and setup details, but if finally came together.

If you can attend one of Winston Hall's speedlight workshops, it will be a great help to you as you approach CLS and remote speedlight photography. Once in a while I join Winston for thirty minutes or so when he is in Phoenix, and present a few of my law enforcement images and discuss their setup and execution. Winston is an excellent, very knowledgeable presenter. Press the "Workshops" button at the top of the page to see schedules.

Your first Nikonian post is excellent. Thanks for joining this discussion.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Thanks for your "Welcome Aboard" and comments concerning CLS - I will definitely look into taking one of Winston's workshops!

Regards,
James

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In spite of the slight blur, I like #1 best. It is the only one of the 4 that captures the story.

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Very nice shots.
I like #1 the best but agree with some of the other comments that it would be better without the CLS TTL at +0.7 stops.

Dan

West Sonoma County Nikonian

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Rick:

Thank you for joining Nikonians. I hope your time with us will be rewarding.

As you can see in this thread there are several different opinions about these images. Diversity like this is what makes photography so interesting.

I look forward to your continued participation in the various Nikonian forums.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Great series Hal. (Herr Flashmeister) I'll vote for #1 for most of the reasons cited previously. It's very inspiring to see the stellar results you achieved using this lens on your D3. Was this a manual focus example or an AF? With the immense DOF of these lenses, I suppose you could have used either. I have an older 3.5 with the built in filters and an F/2.8. Wouldn't trade anything for them. Please share your adventurous shoots with us in the future.

firebasebob

If it needs batteries, it will die.

F2AS, F100, D70s

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Bob:

Thanks for your kind comments. I appreciate them.

I used auto focus, with the focus point on the computer screen, approximately 2.5 feet from the camera. At F/8.0, the depth of field with this lens ranges from 1.4 to 11.7 feet, with 11 percent of it on the near side of the focal plane, and 89 percent of it on the far side.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal,
One of the ex-Nikonians who still gets the newsletter had contacted me and requested to pass this message on

Troup Nightingale wrote...

"Can you help a past Nikonian? You responded to HBB's post of his images inside a police car. I can no longer post to Nikonians, but am getting the newsletter. I noticed that NO ONE commented on images 3 and 4 about HBB's head appearing in the rearview mirror of the police car!!! Could you forward that to the posts? "

Though we have discussed this in my post and your reply to it, I have posted the message as per his request.

Regards
Dinil



Struck by Light - Blog & Gallery
Visible Range - Photography & Beyond

Dinil:

Thanks for passing Troup's comments along.

I do not believe that is my head in the mirror, for two reasons:

1) I do not have that much hair.

2) What little hair I do have is almost white, not blonde.

Beyond those points, the mirror would have to be pointed straight back at me. In these images, it is positioned such that the driver can see out of the rear window. The camera lens was about even with the seat backs, which places it below the line of sight seen in images 3 and 4. Also, there was not room for me to sit exactly in the center of the back seat, I was off to the left of center.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Maybe a bit late in the day, but my personal preference would be with image nr1.

I like the fact that you can see the faces as it is important to see faces. I am still old school and feel that policing is being face-to-face with the public. There is motion in the image so you have the sense of responding to the call. It is people doing their job and without the faces maybe more gaming territory.

The only nitpick that I would have with image nr1 is the right hand being on the leg.

These are my personal opinions and no offense intented.

Don't underestimate the value of Doing Nothing, of just going along, listening to all the things you can't hear, and not bothering. - Winnie the Pooh.

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Albert:

Thank you for your comments. I appreciate them, and they are very helpful as I work through this series of photography sessions with the police department.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal

sorry for taking this long, I've been kind of busy and besides I was trying to figure out how to overcome the tripod dropping to the back, you had, also I have been trying to post this for some days now, and as I am writing this, I am fearful that I had already posted this, hopefully my memory will not play this trick on me and the post was jsut in my mind.... if not please pardon my repetition...

I have concluded that a manfrotto autopole in the car would do just nice, it would fit within floor and ceiling, be tight enough to hold the camera, free up your hands, and maintain the vibration out of the "picture", not sure if you have tried this already but seems that it would be a nice try!

thanks for so much information, this shot was taken a while ago, not the same as you are shooting, but shows a different idea for inside the cabin, it was shot in a bus en-route to Chetumal in southern MExico, near the border with Belize, there was this lightning storm and it was 2 in the morning or so, and decided to go and talk to the driver and wake him up, it is a long ride and I did not wanted to drive there, so the bus was the perfect choice, hope you like this one....

Humberto´s, proud nikonian in Cancun, Mexico

"The important thing is never to stop questioning."~Albert Einstein

"Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."~Yoda

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Attachment #1, (jpg file)

Humberto:

Thanks for posting this lovely, mood-setting image. You have really captured the loneliness of a late night bus ride through stormy weather.

Regards,

HBB in Phoenix, Arizona
Nikonian Team Member

Photography is a journey with no conceivable destination.

Hal

thanks, for your comments on an image that was not intended for this post!!! (but still posted anyway!!!)

I have learned a lot from your images thanks!!!!

Humberto´s, proud nikonian in Cancun, Mexico

"The important thing is never to stop questioning."~Albert Einstein

"Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."~Yoda

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

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