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Forums Lobby MASTER YOUR TOOLS - Hardware & Software Nikon Speedlights & Lighting topic #60634
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Subject: "D5100 owner with CSL question" Previous topic | Next topic
Tangelo Registered since 24th Jan 2013Thu 24-Jan-13 05:00 AM
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"D5100 owner with CSL question"


US
          

Hey guys! SO I just picked up a D5100 and want to purchase 3 speed-lights. trying to figure out the most affordable way to do this. I was thinking a SB700 as my master and two SB600's for off camera? Does that sound right or what other options should I consider?

Thanks!

  

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Replies to this topic
Subject Author Message Date ID
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
luckyphoto Gold Member
24th Jan 2013
1
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Tangelo
24th Jan 2013
2
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
luckyphoto Gold Member
25th Jan 2013
3
     Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Tangelo
25th Jan 2013
4
     Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Photograffiti Silver Member
29th Jan 2013
12
     Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
NenBikonian
25th Jan 2013
6
          Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography
25th Jan 2013
8
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography
25th Jan 2013
5
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography
25th Jan 2013
7
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Tangelo
25th Jan 2013
9
     Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography
25th Jan 2013
10
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Sewerrat
28th Jan 2013
11
Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Tangelo
03rd Feb 2013
13
     Reply message RE: D5100 owner with CSL question
Don Boys
07th Feb 2013
14

luckyphoto Gold Member Nikonian since 27th Dec 2010Thu 24-Jan-13 01:57 PM
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#1. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 0


Port Charlotte, US
          

Welcome to the Nikonians and congratulations on the new D5100. The short answer is yes, using the SB-700 on camera with two SB-600's as remotes will work using CLS as long as the SB-600's can see the infrared signals from the SB-700 master.

One other low cost option might be to buy 1 SB-700, 1 SB-600 and 1 SB-400 if money is a big issue. The SB-400 is not as powerful as the SB-600, but it really depends on what types of photography you want to pursue.

If you're experience with off-camera flash, you could look at non-Nikon flash units, but using CLS might not be possible.

Providing more information about your skill level, types of photography you wish to use the lighting for, etc. would allow forum members to answer your questions more precisely.

Good luck,

Larry

"Red is gray and yellow white, but we decide which is right
....and which is an illusion"

Moody Blues - Nights in White Satin

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Tangelo Registered since 24th Jan 2013Thu 24-Jan-13 05:52 PM
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#2. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 1


US
          

Thanks so much for the help! So I was shooting professionally for a couple years, but that was about 6 years ago. I haven't touched a camera since, so I'm shaking the dust off and catching up with all the new toys on the market.

One reason I jumped back in is I bought a new house with a 930sq. ft. garage. I plan to convert it into a studio and pick up the business again. the problems with my last business was having to travel far for studio space and the costs. now that it's in my backyard, it's time to work!

Sorry for the long explanation. So back to your question, I'm looking to shoot mostly indoor, portraiture work with a lot of fine-art photography as well.

back in the day I had a SB600 and loved it! I want to build the CSL now, but yes, I';m on a budget. I like the idea of 700/600/400. I guess my only concern is the inability to use the 700 off camera. I'm forced to use it as the commander, on camera, right?

Now is there maybe a trigger out there I could buy, to run all 3 of those lights off-camera?

Thanks again for the help!

  

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luckyphoto Gold Member Nikonian since 27th Dec 2010Fri 25-Jan-13 01:20 AM
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#3. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 2


Port Charlotte, US
          

You could run all three with a SU-800 and the SB-400 would make a nice hair light. Unfortunately, you're limited with respect to what 3rd party triggers work with CLS. Most would be manual.

If you don't mind going manual, the Cactus V's are pretty inexpensive. You would need 4 of them at about $30 each. There are other triggers, but my experience is with the Cactus Vs and they work pretty well.

You'll want some modifiers such as umbrellas or softboxes, but with three speedlights should have a very flexible system.

Larry

"Red is gray and yellow white, but we decide which is right
....and which is an illusion"

Moody Blues - Nights in White Satin

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Tangelo Registered since 24th Jan 2013Fri 25-Jan-13 03:17 AM
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#4. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 3


US
          

Thanks again for the help, Lucky. I'm going to go with the 3 speed lights next month when taxes come in.

  

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Photograffiti Silver Member Nikonian since 03rd Apr 2006Tue 29-Jan-13 02:19 AM
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#12. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 4


LA (Lower Arkansas), US
          

The 3 speedlight setup is very nice. I decided to go with 3 SB-700s - all used. I had an SU-800, but found it just a bit unreliable outdoors in certain lighting condiitons, so I picked up a Yongnuo trigger/receiver set and learned how to work with manual controls on the lights. Eventually, it became easy, but I wanted more control. I then started investing in the Pocketwizard FlexTT5 and MiniTT1 units - buying them (also used) one by one. I bought an AC-3 to create zone control of the lights and so far they're working perfectly.

But I'd definitely recommend going with 3 SB-700s over the 700/600 route. The newer interface is so easy to use that I don't bother carrying a manual in my bag. I lived in the manuals of my (former) SB600/800s.

Mark
www.markpricephotography.com

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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NenBikonian Registered since 30th Sep 2011Fri 25-Jan-13 03:01 PM
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#6. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 3


Roswell, US
          

Does the SB400 operate as a CLS remote? I don't think it does.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography Charter MemberFri 25-Jan-13 03:31 PM
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#8. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 6


Richmond Hill, GA (Savannah), US
          

>Does the SB400 operate as a CLS remote? I don't think it
>does.

No it cannot.

Russ
Retired Professional Photographer
Nikonian Moderator
Russell MacDonald Photography
Nikon CLS Practical Guide

  

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Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography Charter MemberFri 25-Jan-13 02:58 PM
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#5. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 1


Richmond Hill, GA (Savannah), US
          

>One other low cost option might be to buy 1 SB-700, 1 SB-600
>and 1 SB-400 if money is a big issue. The SB-400 is not as
>powerful as the SB-600, but it really depends on what types of
>photography you want to pursue.

The SB-400 is a nice little CLS flash, but, unfortunately, it cannot work wirelessly. The term 'CLS' does not mean wireless. CLS is the overall flash system, characterized by the way it fires a Monitor preflash to do its metering. The SB-400 fires a Monitor preflash to do its metering, but it will only work in the hot shoe. Also, it does not have a Commander mode, so it cannot control CLS wireless flashes.

>If you're experience with off-camera flash, you could look at
>non-Nikon flash units, but using CLS might not be possible.

Watch out! Mixing CLS wireless flashes with non-CLS wireless flashes is nearly impossible. The problem is that the CLS Monitor Preflash will trigger all non-CLS flashes before the shutter opens.

Russ
Retired Professional Photographer
Nikonian Moderator
Russell MacDonald Photography
Nikon CLS Practical Guide

  

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Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography Charter MemberFri 25-Jan-13 03:26 PM
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#7. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri 25-Jan-13 10:44 PM by Arkayem

Richmond Hill, GA (Savannah), US
          

>Hey guys! SO I just picked up a D5100 and want to purchase 3
>speed-lights. trying to figure out the most affordable way to
>do this. I was thinking a SB700 as my master and two SB600's
>for off camera? Does that sound right or what other options
>should I consider?
>
>Thanks!

Be careful with the term 'CLS', because it does not mean wireless. 'Wireless' is a subset of CLS called Advanced Wireless Lighting or AWL. Some CLS flashes cannot be used wirelessly. The SB-400 is an example of a CLS flash that cannot be used wirelessly. It can only be used in the hot shoe, and it has no Commander function. Another is the CLS flash inside your D5100. It is CLS but has no Commander function.

Some CLS flashes have Commanders that can control Remote CLS flashes and some do not.

If you want to take full advantage of the CLS wireless system, you will need a CLS Commander in the hot shoe and three external CLS Remotes.

The SB700 can be used as a Commander, but it will only control two CLS Groups wirelessly. This means that you can't have a Main flash, a Fill flash, but no hair light. Of course, if you are experienced, you can use a reflector for the Fill light and use the 2nd group as a hair light, but that is hard to do.

Therefore, I recommend one of the flashes that has a Commander that can control three groups: Main, Fill, and Hair lights. These are the SB-800, SB-900, or SB-910. These flashes all have a 3-Group Commander plus a flash that can be used for additional Fill.

Or, you can use an SU-800, a 3-Group Commander without a flash. The problem with this unit is that its head doesn't tilt or rotate, meaning it sends out its command signals in only one direction, and sometimes it won't fire Remotes that are set too far back beside it. It works fine as long as there is sufficient reflection off the walls and ceiling in your studio, but it doesn't work well outdoors at all. With the other Commander flashes, you can attach a diffuser and point the head straight up and they will fire CLS Remotes in all directions.

The SB-600 is an excellent CLS flash that will work as an CLS Remote, but it does not have a Commander.

The SB-800 and SB-600 are both out of production, but can be purchased used for reasonable prices from online auction sites, and sometimes right here on Nikonians.

Russ
Retired Professional Photographer
Nikonian Moderator
Russell MacDonald Photography
Nikon CLS Practical Guide

  

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Tangelo Registered since 24th Jan 2013Fri 25-Jan-13 06:31 PM
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#9. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 7


US
          

WOW! Some amazing advice, Arkayam, and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks so much!

  

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Arkayem Moderator Awarded for his high level skills in flash photography Charter MemberFri 25-Jan-13 11:11 PM
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#10. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 9


Richmond Hill, GA (Savannah), US
          

>WOW! Some amazing advice, Arkayam, and exactly what I was
>looking for. Thanks so much!

You are most welcome.

Now, be sure to come back and tell us what you eventually decided to do.

Russ
Retired Professional Photographer
Nikonian Moderator
Russell MacDonald Photography
Nikon CLS Practical Guide

  

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Sewerrat Registered since 01st Nov 2012Mon 28-Jan-13 05:13 PM
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#11. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Hi Tangelo,

I have a D5100 that I just bought a few weeks back as well as a D200. I've read all the replys and it basically comes down to your budget (Doesn't it for most of us!).

Lucky for me I have an SU-800 & 3 SB-800s which I use with my D200. I'll be able to use my SU-800 on the D5100 and still have capability of 3 off-camera flash units.

If it was me, I'd go with the SU-800 and then, if I had to due to budget, get only 2 flash units such as SB-600, SB-700, etc... Once you get some sales, you can diversify by adding another flash.

Don't rule out the SU-800 for outdoor use entirely either! You have to pay attention to what you are doing in aligning things up but I've used my setup outdoors lots of times for nature photography in my back yard as evidenced by this pic in my gallery.

Good luck in your photography endeavors!

Regards,

Stan aka Sewerrat

  

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Tangelo Registered since 24th Jan 2013Sun 03-Feb-13 07:40 PM
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#13. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 11


US
          

Thanks for all the help guys. Looks like I'm going with the SB800 and a couple SB600's. That should do me for now. Thanks!

My Website

My Flickr

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Don Boys Registered since 12th Aug 2007Thu 07-Feb-13 01:52 PM
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#14. "RE: D5100 owner with CSL question"
In response to Reply # 13


Hope, US
          

The Yongnuo 560 II for about $70 (Amazon) is as powerful as the SB 900 and can be triggered by an optical pulse (i.e. SU-4 mode) even if you are triggering others using CLS. Put the 560 in S2 mode, manual power, and it delays the flash to account for the pre-flash. It may also lower the camera's sync speed a bit; not sure on that. My suggestion is that you consider the Yongnuo as the second or third flash.

Don Boys
Hope, MI

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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