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Subject: "infrared photography question!" Previous topic | Next topic
pasknucklehead Silver Member Nikonian since 05th Feb 2008Wed 11-Jul-12 06:37 PM
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"infrared photography question!"


US
          

Oh my, I felt like the red-headed step child when I started up my computer a little bit ago and came over here to my favorite site:, I had to actually LOG on. I had to stop and think what my username was:! Actually, I am just recovering from a 3 week bout of pneumonia.....go figure huh!!!
But I'm back and I am thinking about trying out infared photography..Something different I know...Here's my question friends, I did some research and found out I am needing a hoya r72 m72 filter for my d90. I also did some research and found out that if I used my d40 I wouldn't have to have the shutter speed way down because it's built in ir filter isn't as good as the ones in the d90. Here's my thing, I'm wondering though, since the d90 is a better camera, and the one I use the most, would it be worth my while to by the ir filter for the d40 and not my d90...and also, I am seeing the hoya's go for up to $100 and up. I don't know if I can rightly justify spending that kind of money just to play for a day. So I went on ebay and there is one for $16.00 and I know, I know, you pay for what you get, but it is a roxsen 72mm ir infared r72-720nm hoya. don't know what all that means, but that is the same numbers as is advertised on the $150 hoyas...Any advice would be greatly appreciated. missed you guys....

Darlene

  

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Replies to this topic
Subject Author Message Date ID
Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
Leonard62 Gold Member
11th Jul 2012
1
Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
Leonard62 Gold Member
11th Jul 2012
2
Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
espeto68 Gold Member
12th Jul 2012
3
     Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
JosephK Silver Member
12th Jul 2012
4
          Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
Leonard62 Gold Member
12th Jul 2012
5
               Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
pasknucklehead Silver Member
12th Jul 2012
6
                    Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
Leonard62 Gold Member
12th Jul 2012
7
                    Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
mfphoto1
12th Jul 2012
8
                         Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
bbjavelina
12th Jul 2012
9
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Leonard62 Gold Member
12th Jul 2012
10
                              Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
mfphoto1
13th Jul 2012
11
                                   Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
bbjavelina
13th Jul 2012
12
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pasknucklehead Silver Member
13th Jul 2012
13
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OnTERRYo Silver Member
29th Jul 2012
14
                                        Reply message RE: infrared photography question!
mfphoto1
29th Jul 2012
15

Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Wed 11-Jul-12 08:29 PM
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#1. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 0


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

Darlene,

The filter goes on the lens not the camera body. So buy the filter for whichever lens you plan on using. Then you can experiment with both bodies. But be careful which lens you use. Some lenses are not recommended for IR because they cause a "hot" spot in the center of the photo. Not everybody knows which lenses are better but Bjorn comments on IR performance at the end of his capsule lens reviews here:

http://www.naturfotograf.com/lens_surv.html

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Wed 11-Jul-12 09:04 PM
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#2. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 0


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

If you still have the AFS 18-200mm lens that should work for IR. That lens takes a 72mm filter. The Hoya R72 filter refers to the cutoff wavelength of 720 nano-meters for IR. So it attenuates visible light and passes IR above the visible light spectrum. The filter is deep red and you won't be able to frame the scene. It's better to use a tripod before adding the filter.

As far as IR goes the best IR reflectance is in sunlight with green foliage in the picture. Man made material like concrete don't reflect IR hardly at all. So IR photography is aimed more to landscape photography.

Len

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espeto68 Gold Member Nikonian since 29th Aug 2010Thu 12-Jul-12 01:06 AM
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#3. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 2


Oeiras, PT
          

Hi Darlene,

The other option that you have is to convert your D40 to IR, and then you can use any lens you want, with the camera working as a normal one.

José

Nikonians!!! My best investment made after my camera!!!

D700, D90, F80, F Photomic FTn

  

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JosephK Silver Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his excellent and frequent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community in the Nikonians spirit. Nikonian since 17th Apr 2006Thu 12-Jul-12 06:21 AM
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#4. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 3


Seattle, WA, US
          

http://www.LifePixel.com
These guys are one of the big names in IR camera conversions. While I am not a customer, I know a few folks who are happy with their work.

---------+---------+---------+---------+
Joseph K
Seattle, WA, USA

D700, D200, D70S, 24-70mm f/2.8, VR 70-200mm f/2.8 II, 50mm f/1.4 D,
17-55mm f/2.8 DX, 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 VR, 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5 DX

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Thu 12-Jul-12 01:23 PM
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#5. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 4


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

I have a LifePixel converted camera and love it. But I didn't start with one. I don't think I'd spend $250 plus shipping on an experiment for one day to see if I even liked IR photography. And once you convert, that body is dedicated to IR.

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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pasknucklehead Silver Member Nikonian since 05th Feb 2008Thu 12-Jul-12 03:16 PM
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#6. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 5


US
          

Okay, but to my original question, would this rosen ir do the trick instead of investing in the hoya ir filter? I'm thinking about converting the d40, but then again, not sure I want to ruin a completely good camera, it was my first love, so we all know how that goes. let me know what you all think or have tried the cheaper ir filters...

Darlene

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Thu 12-Jul-12 05:39 PM
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#7. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 6


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

Darlene,

I would not buy a Roxsen IR filter from ebay unless you don't mind taking a $20 chance. There are a few reports of poorly made counterfeit Roxsen filters from China. I would buy the Hoya filter. After using it if you find that IR photography isn't for you then sell it here. I would think there are enough photographers interested in IR that you wouldn't have a problem selling it.

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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mfphoto1 Registered since 29th Oct 2005Thu 12-Jul-12 06:56 PM
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#8. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 6


Cincinnati, US
          

>Okay, but to my original question, would this rosen ir do the
>trick instead of investing in the hoya ir filter? I'm
>thinking about converting the d40, but then again, not sure I
>want to ruin a completely good camera, it was my first love,
>so we all know how that goes. let me know what you all think
>or have tried the cheaper ir filters...

The camera isn't ruined if you decide you don't like the infrared conversion. You should get your original filter back with your converted camera, so you can always revert back to the normal camera. Of course I have no idea where I put mine when I got my D70 back, but if I knew where it was I could convert it back. There is a do it yourself tutorial on the lifepixel site.

Before I had my D70 converted I used a cokin filter,

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/387067-REG/Cokin_CA007_A007_Infrared_Resin_Filter.html/BI/4775/KBID/5289/

just be aware that this filter is dark resulting in long exposures, so you need a tripod. The converted camera has relatively normal exposure times and can be done handheld.

"Step into my world and see as I see"

My Nikonians Gallery

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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bbjavelina Registered since 22nd Jun 2008Thu 12-Jul-12 09:34 PM
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#9. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 8


angleton, US
          

I'm not clear here that we are all on the same page, so help me out, please.

There are IR filters that you put on the lens. More or less blocks visible light and lets the IR thru. Your need to compose and focus before installing the filter. Exposure times are extended. I've read that D90's work very poorly at that. Not sure about the 40, but did ask a few years ago and told it was a very poor choice. Has to do with the (hi or lo pass) filter built in --- which can be removed, I'm told.

Then there's that internal filter, mentioned above, which needs to be removed for normal IR work. Pretty much rendering the camera useless for normal work.

I know I'm missing something here, so please help me. This is something I've wanted to do for awhile.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Thu 12-Jul-12 10:21 PM
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#10. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 9


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

I don't know what you're missing. You seem to have it right.

1. All of Nikon's digital cameras have a built in low pass filter that blocks IR to varying degrees. The older bodies like the D1 series and the D2H have less aggressive filters so more of the IR was let through to the sensor. This was a problem to some where things like black fabric had a magenta cast and required an IR blocking filter. This was a serious problem for Leica when they released the M8 digital camera which required adding the IR blocking filter in front of every lens.

2. A deep red IR pass/ visible light blocking filter is required to take IR photos. When added to the front of the lens on a SLR camera body, film or digital, it blocks any view from the viewfinder. You need a tripod and the filter removed to frame the photo before the filter is added and the shutter released.

3. When using this IR filter on the lens and depending on how aggressive the blocking filter is in front of the sensor it can determine if the body can be used at all in the case of recent bodies or how slow a shutter speed and how high an ISO setting is required to get a reasonable exposure. As I recall no matter how long an exposure or high the ISO was set I couldn't get an image at all from the D200. My D1H is fine. I tried a D80 with the R72 filter and it required an exposure at ISO 3200, f5.6 and the exposure bias set to +5 EV. The shutter speed ended up at 1/3 sec for a good exposure in full sun.

4. Now to eliminate the very slow shutter speeds and the viewfinder blocking red filter, you can have the IR filter over the sensor removed and a IR passing filter added. However since infra red focuses at a different point than visible light the AF system in the camera is re-calibrated to IR. The company that removed the old filter and adds the new filter will do this. Nikon's older lenses had red focus dots on the dof ring on where to move the focus after focusing with visible light. That normally meant you had to focus a little closer than what the focus distance scale indicated.

5. So now you have your camera modified with a new filter and the AF calibrated. From here on in taking your photos is just like it was before your camera was modified. You no longer need a filter over the lens. The camera's meter will give you pretty good exposures but in some cases not perfect. Bracketing would be a good practice.

6. The final step after you take your photos is post processing. Your digital images will now look pink. There are a couple of things you need to do. First to get the all white foliage b&w photo you see in so many IR photos you need to de-saturate the image and then bring up the levels to get a nice balanced histogram. You're just about there. A little touch up in exposure or maybe contrast and you've got a nice b&w IR photo.

Or if you want a somewhat false color IR photo you can adjust the colors in the color channels. There are lessons on how to do this. The photos can look quite striking. LifePixel also has different strength IR filters for the sensor that can make this easier to do then with a strong IR filter. It lets some of the visible light through.

And that's about it. I don't know if I've missed anything but if I have I'm sure someone will jump in.

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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mfphoto1 Registered since 29th Oct 2005Fri 13-Jul-12 07:11 AM
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#11. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 9
Fri 13-Jul-12 07:28 AM by mfphoto1

Cincinnati, US
          

>Then there's that internal filter, mentioned above, which
>needs to be removed for normal IR work. Pretty much rendering
>the camera useless for normal work.

You are correct once the internal filter is removed and the infrared filter installed you cannot use the camera for normal work. That being said, if in the future you decide that you no longer want the camera to be infrared you just need to have the infrared filter removed and re-install the original low/pass filter and your camera is back to standard shooting.

A couple of suggestions:
1) If your not using the D40 that much, consider getting that one converted to infrared. There is a world of difference between using the filter and using a converted camera.

2)or if your just not sure yet, you might find some decent prices for used filters on Ebay or at local flea markets or camera swaps. I bought my first Cokin Infrared filter at a camera swap for about 10 bucks. As a matter of fact if I can find it I'll sell it to you for 10 bucks.

"Step into my world and see as I see"

My Nikonians Gallery

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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bbjavelina Registered since 22nd Jun 2008Fri 13-Jul-12 01:49 PM
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#12. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 11


angleton, US
          

Thanks, I've got it now.

Appreciate the replies.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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pasknucklehead Silver Member Nikonian since 05th Feb 2008Fri 13-Jul-12 05:18 PM
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#13. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 11


US
          

Well, heck, get in that closet and start looking...!!!!!!!!!!!!!! keep me posted..................

Darlene

  

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OnTERRYo Silver Member Nikonian since 25th Nov 2011Sun 29-Jul-12 02:22 AM
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#14. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 13


Hamilton, CA
          

Hi Darlene,

I'll be watching this thread with interest.
I just (today) picked up a used D70 with the distinct
possibility of dedicating to IR.

Terry.

OnTERRYo

"The Nikon did the work; I just happened to be behind it at the time." TP

  

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mfphoto1 Registered since 29th Oct 2005Sun 29-Jul-12 03:18 AM
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#15. "RE: infrared photography question!"
In response to Reply # 13


Cincinnati, US
          

>Well, heck, get in that closet and start
>looking...!!!!!!!!!!!!!! keep me posted..................

I've been looking, but haven't found it yet.

"Step into my world and see as I see"

My Nikonians Gallery

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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