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Subject: "Is the D70 out ?" Previous topic | Next topic
CBi Registered since 13th May 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 01:56 AM
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"Is the D70 out ?"


Tokyo, JP
          

Canon with the EOS 20D seems to have corrected some of the "flaws" that made the superiority of the D70, such as quick start-up. It is also getting some edge over Nikon, for instance the USB 2.0 connection.

As a whole, is the D70 still on top ? or is there some really outstanding feature of the EOS 20D... that should make us dream of the D80 ?

Since I have not got a D70 myself I wonder = should I wait ?

Christophe - Tokyo

  

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Fountainhead
21st Aug 2004
1
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OpenRoad
21st Aug 2004
2
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jonkun227
21st Aug 2004
3
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Len Shepherd Gold Member
23rd Aug 2004
11
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daytrader408
21st Aug 2004
4
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Axe
25th Aug 2004
23
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darichardson Silver Member
21st Aug 2004
5
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edmun
21st Aug 2004
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avm247 Moderator Awarded for high skills in documentary architecture and aviation photography Donor Ribbon. Awarded for his support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
21st Aug 2004
7
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akjim907
21st Aug 2004
8
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22nd Aug 2004
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migpower
22nd Aug 2004
10
Reply message Go away troll...
Daytona955i
23rd Aug 2004
12
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Axe
25th Aug 2004
24
Reply message RE: Is the D70 out ? -- Just think ;-)
overney
23rd Aug 2004
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Mike_walters
23rd Aug 2004
14
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Bleed
24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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24th Aug 2004
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25th Aug 2004
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25th Aug 2004
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26th Aug 2004
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27th Aug 2004
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29th Aug 2004
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30th Aug 2004
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30th Aug 2004
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30th Aug 2004
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Fountainhead Basic MemberSat 21-Aug-04 02:33 AM
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#1. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Well, the 20D seems more an update to the 10D, which you could say was pitted against the D100, rather than the D70. I think there is a large enough price difference between the D70 body ($999) and the announced D20 (~$1500) to avoid a direct comparison. The 20D does look quite nice, from what we've been shown. I wonder if Nikon has a D100 update somewhere in the pipe?

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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OpenRoad Registered since 16th May 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 03:44 AM
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#2. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

If you want to wait then you'll be waiting forever because eventually the D100 will come out with a better version. Camera companies are constantly trying to beat each other, so there will always be a camera consumers will think is better. It's like the computer industry. If you keep waiting for a better camera you'll wait forever. The grass will always seem greener on the other side, if you are familiar with that American expression, but a good photographer will take great pictures no matter what camera they use. It's true that some features will make it easier to take certain pictures but it's still the photographer that makes the difference.

Also it has been mentioned that the 20D is in a different price category so if you are willing to pay that much then by all means include it in your choices. The D70's direct price competition would be the Canon 300D, which I don't really think is a competition with all the features of the D70. IMO it's more in the league of the 10D/20D but without the higher price. I'm sure Canon will eventually upgrade the 300D so if you want to wait for that then go ahead, but you'll be missing a lot of pictures from now till then.

One other factor is that Fujifilm also uses the Nikon lense mount so you really have two companies to choose from in the future. Most people get too concerned about what camera is the best. IMO you should be thinking which camera system you want to invest in because camera bodies will come and go but you'll most likely keep your lenses for a long time. IMO investment in quality lenses is more important because your digital camera body will most likely be outdated next year.

  

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jonkun227 Registered since 20th Apr 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 04:45 AM
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#3. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 2


Salt Lake City, US
          

I would love for Nikon to feel that the 20D is competition enough for the D70 that they have to lower the price of the D70 to keep up the interest. Then I could buy another D70!

The Two will always play cat and mouse with updated cameras, though at a higher clip now in the digital realm than they did/do in the film world. Don't get too obsessed with which company is better: they're basically the same, but the fact that there are two (actually more than two, but that's all most people focus on) keeps prices down through healthy competition.

Bring it on Canon.

By the way (as though you wanted to know why), I chose Nikon over Canon because of the interface. I had used my Dad's EOS 1000 long before I owned my own camera. I used a Pentax in school, then bought a Minolta in Chinatown. Later I upgraded to a much nicer Minolta (which I doubt I'll ever part with). Finally I tried a Nikon and found that the interface was so much easier than any of the others I'd used (with the minor exception of the AF in my Minolta). I don't see much of a difference between the different ones in terms of image quality, because I was behind the lens in all cases. Nikon is a little sharper, but not as much as most people hype it up to be. My Minolta is a fourth the size of my Nikon, and at least twice as fast. The Pentax was an idiot-proof camera more than any other I'd used (in terms of handing it to someone else to take a picture of you when the occasion arises). And the Canon is still perfectly capable.

Quit fussing so much about which camera. Pick one and develop your skills. If you ever reach the point that your skill has exceeded your camera's abilities you will have achieved photographic nirvana, and you can enlighten the rest of us if you wish.


- Jon

_____________________

As I sat there watching the light change from red, to green, to yellow, and back to red again, I wondered what life was all about. Was it really just a lot of honking and yelling? Sometimes it seems that way

  

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Len Shepherd Gold Member Nikonian since 09th Mar 2003Mon 23-Aug-04 04:17 AM
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#11. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 3


Yorkshire, UK
          

>I would love for Nikon to feel that the 20D is competition
>enough for the D70 that they have to lower the price of the
>D70 to keep up the interest. Then I could buy another D70!
>
Nikon (and dealers)have not reduced the price because it has been an unprecedented success, with regular back orders and production being cranked up to 1,000,000 units a year.
It is unusual for a camera not to be available at a discount 6 months after launch.

There is nothing to compete in it's price range.
The price will not drop until there is, or supplies catch up with demand.

Photography is a bit like archery. A technically better camera, lens or arrow may not hit the target as often as it could if the photographer or archer does not practice enough.

Len Shepherd

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 04:46 AM
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#4. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 2



          

i am pretty sure Nikon has something up their sleeves... they are waiting for Canon to come out with the 20D first before they come out with the upgrade to D100. I am very surprised that Nikon has not lowered the price for D100 after they released the D70. I would much rather get the D70 w/lens then for the same price of just D100 body.

I wont be surprised if the D100 drops to 1199 for body only soon...currently still 1499 at ritz camera



  

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Axe Registered since 28th Aug 2003Wed 25-Aug-04 04:10 AM
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#23. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 4


Sarasota, US
          

I've got a D100, and if I had to buy it over again, I'd still choose the D100

John
--
http://www.reptilerooms.com

  

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darichardson Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Jun 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 10:34 AM
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#5. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Portland, US
          

I can't say if you should wait for a D80 or D200 or whatever non-pro DSLR Nikon will release next.

If you try to chase the lastest digital body, you'll be changing brands often. I expect Nikon and Canon to be leap-frogging each other for the next few year. Digital technology is still evolving and we're going to continue to see big breakthroughs in DSLRs for a while.

Given this, my advice is to buy based on the lenses, not the body. Over time you will likely have a much larger investment in lenses that bodies. While DSLRs will become obsolete after a few years, the lenses will not (at least with Nikon they haven't yet). Pick a brand and stick with it.

David


Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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edmun Registered since 16th Sep 2003Sat 21-Aug-04 05:21 PM
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#6. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 5


eugene, US
          

There is always the new Kodak that is full frame and uses Nikon lens it clearly blows away the Canon. Just save your nickles.

My friend has one and it only has a 512 buffer for multiple shots.

ledmun

  

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avm247 Moderator Awarded for high skills in documentary architecture and aviation photography Donor Ribbon. Awarded for his support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Charter MemberSat 21-Aug-04 06:14 PM
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#7. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Rancho Cordova, US
          

For most users, the D70 is plenty of camera. While updates in technology and gee whiz gadgets is great, how much of it will really affect your photography?

Nikon does not release udpated cameras every six months. For a long time, Canon was behind the curve with the introduction of the original D1.

While Canon was first out of the gate in the $2000 price point with the D30, Nikon responded with the D100 which, as far as I know is still in production. In the mean time, Canon has released the D60, the 10D and has now announced the 20D.

At the $1000 price point, Canon was first out of the gate again with the DRebel (300D) around Xmas 2003 and the Nikon D70 was released around late March 2004. If it were my money, I'd still want a D70 over a DRebel.

The announcement of the 20D really has me salivating about what Nikon will release at Photokina 2004 in September.

Remember, the amount of time you spend waiting is time you are not enjoying your camera! I still shoot film and for digital, make do with a Coolpix 4500 kit. If you decide to wait, you'll always be on the sidelines.

Anthony

The Moderator Page and My Gallery
"The important things in life are simple; the simple things are hard."

Anthony

The Moderator Page and My Gallery
The important things in life are simple; the simple things are hard.

  

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akjim907 Registered since 08th Aug 2004Sat 21-Aug-04 08:46 PM
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#8. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Anchorage, US
          

First off you are asking a question like this in a Nikon D-70 Forum? What sort of answers would you expect?

Anyway, like another member pointed out, if you wait til the next best thing comes out, you'll be waiting your whole life. Get a camera now and start enjoying the "art" of photography.

Personally for the $$ the D-70 is hard to beat. And of course the entire line-up of Nikon lens are legendary. Before long you'll have more into the lens then the body then 3-5 years from now get the best available body and continue to enjoy your Nikon lens you already have.

Remember you are in a Nikon Forum! LOL

-Good Luck with your choice-

Cheers


Jim - Nikonian in Alaska

www.jimjensen.org

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Sun 22-Aug-04 06:22 PM
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#9. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 8



          

just make sure you buy quality lenses, the D70 body i would say is still good for another 2-3 years before it needs upgrading.

  

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migpower Registered since 18th Jul 2004Sun 22-Aug-04 10:28 PM
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#10. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 9


Cartaxo, PT
          

Hi!
I still have and use the OLD Nikon F, it has my age... and never need an upgrade to keep taking good pictures.
Likewise the D70 will take the same quality pictures in 2, 3 or 10 years as it does today. Of course it will come a D75, a D80 and so on.... just hope thay dont change for the 3/4 type technology so the investment on Dx lenses is not wasted. That's what matters!

my 1 cent....

Cheers

S, S Brass, S2,S2 BD, F, F Black, FTn, F36, F250 Black, F2 Black, F2A, F2AS Black, F3/T Champagne, F3/T Black, F3P, FG Black, FM2/T, 35TI, 28TI, F4e, F5, D2H, D200, D700 ... Two Bessa R2S NHS!

Others take pictures, Nikon takes Life with you!

Remember, the World is Analog!!!

My Nikonians Gallery
My Flickr Gallery

  

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Daytona955i Registered since 01st Jun 2004Mon 23-Aug-04 04:45 AM
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#12. "Go away troll..."
In response to Reply # 0


Boonton, US
          

So you are saying that with a more expensive camera, the cannon finally cought up? The only plus you mention is USB 2.0 but really... who doesn't use a card reader making this a completely moot point?

Personally I think in a price comparison the D70 is closer to the rebel whereas feature wise, the D70 is closer to the 10/20D. What does this say about cannon? When I first bought me film SLR I had a decision to make... Nikon or Cannon. I decided on Nikon and I haven't once regretted it. When the rebel first came out I thought about it but I really wasn't that impressed. Sure they have some digital cameras that are really nice but they cost more than $3k which is way out of my budget. The D70 fits my needs perfectly and I would still purchase it over a 10D or a 20D.

If you like cannon, wait and get a cannon, if you want a real camera, get a Nikon. You could even wait for Nikon's next digital SLR to come out. Hopefully it will be as impressive as the D70.

  

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Axe Registered since 28th Aug 2003Wed 25-Aug-04 04:12 AM
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#24. "RE: Go away troll..."
In response to Reply # 12


Sarasota, US
          

>The only plus you mention is USB 2.0 but really... who doesn't
>use a card reader making this a completely moot point?

This is a huge deal to those shooting tethered to a desktop or laptop computer.

John
--
http://www.reptilerooms.com

  

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overney Registered since 18th Jul 2004Mon 23-Aug-04 08:10 AM
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#13. "RE: Is the D70 out ? -- Just think ;-)"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

I still use my Coolpix 990 to take very good pictures. So, the D70 in the hands of a capable photographer will do very well. A 20D does not change this and you should know this. So why ask this question? What is your intend?

Regarding the 20D, the great features of the Canon 20D are:

a) Much better AF system than d100, d70 and 10d (but worse than D2H)
b) Better resolution than d100, d70 and 10d
c) Faster frame rate than d100, d70 and 10d (but worse than D2H)

USB 2.0 is not really adding too much value when taking pictures.

I wonder why they did not increase the size of the CMOS image sensor? A cropping factor of 1.6 vs. 1.5 (D70 and D100) does not really excite me too much.

I am very happy to see that Canon came out with a nice new model in such a short time. This will keep the price low on Nikon's D70 and, of course, will keep the wheel turning. Next stop, 14-bit instead of 12-bit (…I really need more dynamic range!!!)

Gregor

My photo galleries at http://picasaweb.google.com/Gregor.Overney/

  

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Mike_walters Registered since 04th Apr 2003Mon 23-Aug-04 09:36 AM
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#14. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Taunton, UK
          

If you are a Nikon user then the D70 is the choice. There will be newer digital models than the D70, but currently why would Nikon want to put out a camera in the same price range as the D70 when D70 sales are so high. The EOS20D is 150% the price of a D70, but does it perform 150% better? I think not. I am certain that Nikon will put out a camera to compete with the EOS20D but it will be in the same price range.

Dont forget it is the phyotographer that gets the good pictures, the camera is just a tool to get good pictures. If you give me the best word processor in the world I aint going to write a best selling novel.

Regards

My website Digital Eyes Photography
My Nikonians Gallery


Mike

  

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Bleed Registered since 17th Aug 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 03:31 PM
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#15. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0



          

I'm a novice so my 2cents may be worth half that but like everyone knows if you're waiting for the next best thing then you aren't taking photos but I'm not one to talk (it took me a year to get a computer because I was waiting for the next processor or the next gen graphics card). I agree with Gregor on his points after a cursory look at the 20D on dpreview. Since they are in different price brackets comparison might be unfair. As far as my budget is concerned the D70 is more than enough camera; but I have to admit, the black and white shooting feature of the 20D does raise my curiosity a bit. What do you more seasoned shooters think about this feature?

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/canoneos20d/page12.asp

With the D70 doing as well as it is I don't see the point in Nikon coming out with another model in the same price range... but a price drop in a few months is another story. Good luck to you all.

Kevin

  

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Daytona955i Registered since 01st Jun 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 04:01 PM
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#16. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 15


Boonton, US
          

Personally I think the B&W aspect is a gimick. It's still just taking a color picture and converting it to B&W. I can do that in Photoshop. You still don't have the same dynamic range that you would get from shooting real B&W film.

  

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Mike_walters Registered since 04th Apr 2003Tue 24-Aug-04 04:58 PM
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#18. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 16


Taunton, UK
          

hmm, I think the B&W feature plus the B&W filters the EOS20D offers would be quite interesting and something I would definately make use of. You would be able to see what the B&W image looks like instantly. This must be a software implementation so I wonder if Nikon would be up for putting anything like this into future releases of D70 software????

Regards

My website Digital Eyes Photography
My Nikonians Gallery


Mike

  

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selcuk gore Registered since 13th Jul 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 04:57 PM
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#17. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Istanbul, TR
          

>Canon with the EOS 20D seems to have corrected some of the
>"flaws" that made the superiority of the D70, such as quick
>start-up. It is also getting some edge over Nikon, for
>instance the USB 2.0 connection.
>
>As a whole, is the D70 still on top ? or is there some
>really outstanding feature of the EOS 20D... that should
>make us dream of the D80 ?
>
>Since I have not got a D70 myself I wonder = should I wait ?

Why it should be out?.. Is it just started producing worse results or started to perform worse, when compared to a week ago?.

Of course you can wait but there is a question... till when?

Time is passing by..

Regards,

Selçuk

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 05:26 PM
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#19. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 17



          

i personally dont think there will be a replacement for the d70 anytime soon... i think what Nikon should of done was to discontinue the d100 at the time of the d70 release. The d70 is all around a better camera than the d100.. at 50% less... the replacement for the d100 should be coming shortly. there might be a huge rebate program coming up for the d100 to increase sales.

i dont expect the d70 to have a replacement for atleast another 1- 1 1/2 yrs... its still too new.. based on the comments i got from Ritz camera, its the #1 selling camera at the moment.

  

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jxpfeer Registered since 11th Jun 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 07:12 PM
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#20. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 19


Boston, US
          

i think the b&w thing is a gimmick too, and a silly one to be honest. why sit and fiddle with the different "color" filters, which just change the B&W conversion in camera... i personally prefer to do a B&W conversion afterwards, in photoshop. you can always take the color out (selectively), but you can't ever put it back in. to me taking a B&W photo in camera, is like taking a 2MP image when you have 6mp available.

-jay
D70
http://jxpfeer.dpcprints.com

  

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cwilt Registered since 24th Aug 2004Tue 24-Aug-04 11:02 PM
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#21. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Denver, US
          

The press release of a 20D did not make my D70 shots worse.

I think it all comes down to three things....

1. What you want
2. When do you want it
3. How much are you willing to pay for it

The D70 was a big jump for me, but I knew that I would grow into it. I may never use all the power and features of the D70 but they are there now, if I need them.

Charles

  

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vchong Basic MemberWed 25-Aug-04 01:55 AM
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#22. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Victoria, CA
          

Christophe, if you can afford to pay the extra money for the 20D, then by all means buy it when it comes out. Nikon's D100 replacement is around the corner though (from the rumour mill), and after that gets released, Canon will come back with something greater of course...

http://www.finearts.uvic.ca/~vchong/images/vchong.gif

  

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jxpfeer Registered since 11th Jun 2004Wed 25-Aug-04 10:26 PM
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#25. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Boston, US
          

there is always something new around the corner. there'll be a replacement to the d100, then a d1x replacement, then the d2h will get replaced, then the d70...

in the meantime, canon will be releasing bodies just as fast, or faster. so you can wait forever, or just buy now.

-jay
D70
http://jxpfeer.dpcprints.com

  

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Mike_walters Registered since 04th Apr 2003Thu 26-Aug-04 09:28 AM
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#26. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 25


Taunton, UK
          

There is one way to end the equipment envy syndrome. You finally pursuaded the wife that it was a worthwhile investment etc etc etc and she finally caved in and let you buy your dream camera. So now you have your D70, its great and you love it. But hey, look, something better is looming on the Horizon. You check out the specs and find that the new camera has IBDB (In Built David Bailey) and AA mode (Ansel Adams mode). The new camera weighs twice that of a D70, (must be a pro spec then) it has a pop up flash that has the same GN of a nuclear explosion and flash synch of 1 millionth of a second, an ISO range of 1 - 10,000. Not only does it have auto compose for colour pictures but it also will do Black and white, sepia, magenta (er.....dont need that, my epson printer ddoes just fine there) so you just know this is gonna make you a better photographer. Suddenly the D70 is not taking as good a picture as it did yesterday, a friend or neighbour may buy this new camera and make you look cheap and amatuerish with your D70 so you just gotta have it..........

And now the cure.....


Tell the wife you want another more expensive DSLR just weeks or months after you spent nearly £1000 on your D70 and suddenly you lose interest completely in the new camera.........try it, it really does work.



Regards

My website Digital Eyes Photography
My Nikonians Gallery


Mike

  

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Dug Registered since 21st May 2004Fri 27-Aug-04 12:41 PM
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#27. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 26


MAROOCHYDORE, AU
          

Look at the work of Edward Weston Ansel Adams and Imogene Cunningham. All worked with a single camera, single lens and usually with a great shortage of film. Weston often had to choose between food or film.
Study how they looked at things and saw the beauty not the technology.
Read "The daybooks of Edward Weston" they give an insight into how he worked and the struggles he faced both in art and life. Then go out and chose a camera!

As an exercise cut down your gear to the simplest you can one camera one lens Prime if possible and one roll of film or just a few shots.

Photography is what happens in your brain not in some marvelous piece of new equipment. I never forget the lessons shooting 5" X 4" taught me about looking before pressing that button.

I love my D70 and my lens collection but they need to earn me a living before they are even considered.

na

  

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Mike_walters Registered since 04th Apr 2003Fri 27-Aug-04 04:07 PM
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#28. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 27


Taunton, UK
          

Yep, I got to admit when I was doing a college course in photography we were asked to take one lens (a 50mm) and a roll of black & white film and my shots from that made me think a lot more about what I was taking. With the D70 I tent to take a lot more snap shots......so I think the advice you give is something all photographers should take heed of.

Regards


My website Digital Eyes Photography
My Nikonians Gallery


Mike

  

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GChapp Registered since 26th Jun 2004Sun 29-Aug-04 07:24 PM
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#29. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Los Angeles, US
          

I'm a novice, I'd say, and am very happy with the D70. I got the kit lense, as well as the 12-24 wide angle. ($ ouch)

For my uses, I probably won't upgrade until a camera similar to the D70 comes out with more MP a greater light range. "Dynamic range" I believe it's called. That is my chief desire. And less noise while maintaining resolution.

GC

GChapp

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 01:06 AM
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#30. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 29



          

i've decided to go ahead and return my D70 kit to Ritz today, Paid $1299.00 + tax, and decided to go ahead and place a pre-order for the Canon D20 $1599 (no tax). So in total I am paying less than $200 more for the D20 w/lens...I had to exchange the D70 many times at Ritz due to the dark circle problem in all the picture and I just got tired of it.


  

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OpenRoad Registered since 16th May 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 03:26 AM
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#31. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 30


US
          

>i've decided to go ahead and return my D70 kit to Ritz
>today, Paid $1299.00 + tax, and decided to go ahead and
>place a pre-order for the Canon D20 $1599 (no tax). So in
>total I am paying less than $200 more for the D20 w/lens...

Actually, you are paying about $500 more for the 20D. If you want to get a cheap $100 lense you could have easily done that with the D70 too, but Nikon decided to give its owners a better kit lense. For the body only, the D70 is $999.95. Now add a cheap $100 lense and the price would be $1099.95. Also there have been complaints from Canon 300D owners about their $100 kit lense so what you have stated is false economics. You'll probably end up buying a better lense anyway.


>I had to exchange the D70 many times at Ritz due to the dark
>circle problem in all the picture and I just got tired of
>it.

Are you talking about vignetting or dark small circles usually caused by dust particles on the sensor? It doesn't matter which you are talking about because all DSLR cameras have this problem. Vignetting is usually due to user error though. If your problem is not either things I've mentioned then you have some weird problem because I'm having no problems with my D70.

I really don't care if people choose to switch, because it's your right but at least switch for valid reasons. If you are constantly having some weird unexplainable problem then I understand your reasons for switching...but you should know that Canon cameras also have their own problems.

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 06:44 AM
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#32. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 31



          

>Are you talking about vignetting or dark small circles
>usually caused by dust particles on the sensor? It doesn't
>matter which you are talking about because all DSLR cameras
>have this problem. Vignetting is usually due to user error
>though. If your problem is not either things I've mentioned
>then you have some weird problem because I'm having no
>problems with my D70.

yes, i am refering to dark circles in the pictures... you can totally see the circles if you have a blue background. are you saying that all the digital cameras have this? I had never had this problem with a point and shoot digital camera. Everyone of the D70 I have tried are brand new out of the box, so there should be no issues with dust particles on the CCD. I also tried out a brand new D100 and also a Canon 300 and had no issues with the circles,


  

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OpenRoad Registered since 16th May 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 07:36 AM
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#33. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 32


US
          

>yes, i am refering to dark circles in the pictures... you
>can totally see the circles if you have a blue background.
>are you saying that all the digital cameras have this? I
>had never had this problem with a point and shoot digital
>camera. Everyone of the D70 I have tried are brand new out
>of the box, so there should be no issues with dust particles
>on the CCD. I also tried out a brand new D100 and also a
>Canon 300 and had no issues with the circles,

It definitely sounds like dust particles. I'm not saying all digital cameras have this. What I'm saying is that all digital SLR cameras have this problem because when you change lenses you allow the chance for dust to get on the sensors. Point and shoot cameras are sealed and you can't change their lenses so they won't get dust on their sensors.

Unless you never change your lenses or are lucky then you will eventually get dust. It's just one of the drawbacks or owning a DSLR. Having to clean the sensor is just one of the chores we have to live with. Canon's DSLR are not immune to this.

However, it is Nikon's fault that there is dust from the factory. They must be rushing out cameras to meet the demand. If you are buying your camera from a store then ask them to allow you to take test shots to see if there is any dust. You'll eventually have clean dust anyway so it's best to learn how to do it. First try a blower but if that doesn't work then go to this site: http://www.pbase.com/copperhill/ccd_cleaning

Once you clean your sensor a few times it won't be a big deal. It's like cleaning your lenses. Also to minimize dust make sure to only change lenses in a non-windy environment. If you do have to change lenses when it's windy then turn your back to the wind.

FYI, my camera started out dust free but I had to eventually clean it. I've seen and heard plenty of Canon owners with dust on their sensors. It's something digital SLR owners have to live with. On film SLR cameras the "sensor" is film so it gets changed everytime you change film but this is not the case for DSLR cameras. Just get used to it...or stay with point and shoot cameras.

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 08:14 AM
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#34. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 33



          

i understand there are dust/particles that can get into the camera when changing the lenses or even brand new from the Nikon factory.. the only thing I dont understand is how in the world can the dust/particles show up as "DARK CIRCLES?" if it really was dust particles, then wouldnt the dust show up as lines in the pictures instead of perfectly round dark circles? When I zoomed in on the dark circle area, it definitely doesnt seem like dust...


  

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OpenRoad Registered since 16th May 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 08:28 AM
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#35. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 34


US
          

I don't know the technical reason why they are round but they can actually be several shapes. Some of mine are round or oval shaped. Here is a link to a sample picture: http://www.pbase.com/image/20980695

It's the site that I linked above. Does the circles not look like yours? If yours is completely different then you've got some weird problem.

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 08:44 AM
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#36. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 35



          

>I don't know the technical reason why they are round but
>they can actually be several shapes. Some of mine are round
>or oval shaped. Here is a link to a sample picture:
>http://www.pbase.com/image/20980695
>
>It's the site that I linked above. Does the circles not look
>like yours? If yours is completely different then you've got
>some weird problem.



yup. thats's exactly what the circle looks like. This goes to show me that Nikon Thailand really does a crappy job assembling the D70 (probably not in a clean room). So I wonder where the D100 is built at, since the one that I tested did not have the circles.

  

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OpenRoad Registered since 16th May 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 08:50 AM
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#37. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 36


US
          

Here is another site that shows Canon cameras with the same problem: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/sensor-cleaning.shtml

Anyway, ask the dealer if they will clean the sensor for you...but you'll eventually have to clean it yourself anyway so it's good to learn.

  

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Daytona955i Registered since 01st Jun 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 02:41 PM
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#38. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 30


Boonton, US
          

>i've decided to go ahead and return my D70 kit to Ritz
>today, Paid $1299.00 + tax, and decided to go ahead and
>place a pre-order for the Canon D20 $1599 (no tax). So in
>total I am paying less than $200 more for the D20 w/lens...I
>had to exchange the D70 many times at Ritz due to the dark
>circle problem in all the picture and I just got tired of
>it.

$1599-$1299 = $300 not $200. Also you'd probably want a better lens than the kit lens from canon but if you don't care about that, let's compare bodies only. Then the canon is $1,499.95 and the Nikon is $999.95 so $1499.95-$999.95=$500. Of course if you are spending about a thousand or more on a camera body alone, I'd want a good quality lens on it.

  

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daytrader408 Registered since 02nd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 03:59 PM
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#39. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 38



          

>>i've decided to go ahead and return my D70 kit to Ritz
>>today, Paid $1299.00 + tax, and decided to go ahead and
>>place a pre-order for the Canon D20 $1599 (no tax). So in
>>total I am paying less than $200 more for the D20 w/lens...I
>>had to exchange the D70 many times at Ritz due to the dark
>>circle problem in all the picture and I just got tired of
>>it.
>
>$1599-$1299 = $300 not $200. Also you'd probably want a
>better lens than the kit lens from canon but if you don't
>care about that, let's compare bodies only. Then the canon
>is $1,499.95 and the Nikon is $999.95 so
>$1499.95-$999.95=$500. Of course if you are spending about a
>thousand or more on a camera body alone, I'd want a good
>quality lens on it.

originaly I paid $1299 + tax 8.25%. I am going to buy the D20 online so I save on taxes, so it will be $1599 shipped (approx ~$200 more)

  

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JeffKohn Registered since 03rd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 06:09 PM
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#41. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 39


Houston, US
          

Just remember that comparing the D70 kit lense to the 300D/20D kit lens is not an apples/oranges comparison. More like a BMW/Yugo comparison...

  

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vinh Registered since 30th Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 08:15 PM
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#42. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 39


US
          

>originaly I paid $1299 + tax 8.25%. I am going to buy the
>D20 online so I save on taxes, so it will be $1599 shipped
>(approx ~$200 more)

it sounds like you live in California? i.e. the 8.25% sales tax. do note that California charges Use Tax when filing your return, thus purchases made over the internet are also subject to tax.

also, if you felt you saved money from tax by buying the D20 (did you really mean the 20D?) online, you should also recognize that the D70 could also be purchased online. any way you look at it, the 20D is about $300 more (or $500-600 more if you don't include the D70's kit lens), enough to buy a compact camera or go towards a second lens.

  

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JeffKohn Registered since 03rd Aug 2004Mon 30-Aug-04 06:08 PM
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#40. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 0


Houston, US
          

I don't think Nikon has much to worry about. Honestly, Nikon and Canon seem to go after slightly different markets. Yes, both have "systems" and offering to target pros and amateurs alike. But Canon's bread and butter is the consumer oriented Rebel line and it shows not just in their advertising but also their feature sets, controls/interface, etc. Just look at how the crippled the 300D was; their attitude was probably that the customers in that market space don't need advanced controls, etc. Seems kinda patronizing to me. Maybe if they didn't spend quite so much on advertising and endorsements they could afford to put some of those features back in. What's interesting is that this attitude seems to even extend to the 20D, which you could argue is more of an entry-level "pro" camera. Yes, the 20D is a big improvement over the 300D, but how about adding a freaking SPOT METER instead of these gimmicky B&W modes. And that kit lens is a joke....

IMHO the missing spot meter is a deal breaker, I can't imagine too many serious landscape/nature photographers wanting a camera with no spot meter. Canon dropped the ball big time on that one.

  

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Mike_walters Registered since 04th Apr 2003Tue 31-Aug-04 11:54 AM
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#43. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 40


Taunton, UK
          

The 20D hasnt got a spot meter!!!!!!!!! ha ha ha ha.

I cant imagine a serious photographer getting by without a spot meter. I use spot metering more andmore, especially now I have gone digital as it give me the choice of what I want exposed correclty in high contrast situations.

Are you sure it doesnt have a spot meter????


Regards



My website Digital Eyes Photography
My Nikonians Gallery


Mike

  

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JeffKohn Registered since 03rd Aug 2004Tue 31-Aug-04 04:38 PM
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#44. "RE: Is the D70 out ?"
In response to Reply # 43


Houston, US
          

>The 20D hasnt got a spot meter!!!!!!!!! ha ha ha ha.
>
>I cant imagine a serious photographer getting by without a
>spot meter. I use spot metering more andmore, especially now
>I have gone digital as it give me the choice of what I want
>exposed correclty in high contrast situations.
>
>Are you sure it doesnt have a spot meter????

That's what I've heard in several places. Looking at the preview on DPReview.com, it apparently has Evaluative, Center-weighted, and "Partial" metering, which uses 9% of the center part of the image. I guess that's not a true spot meter but might do in a fix as long as you can find something big enough to meter off of.

  

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