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Subject: "Color management for NX2 on Windows 7" Previous topic | Next topic
TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Wed 23-Dec-09 01:34 PM
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"Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"


Apex, US
          

I recently upgraded my photo laptop from Vista to Windows 7. I recalibrated my display with my i1 Display 2. I've noticed that photos that I had previously edited in NX2 do not look right when I open them in NX2. If I look at them in Photo Mechanic, they look like how I remember them. In NX2, they look dull and washed out unless I convert the profile to sRGB. It is as if NX2 is not able to work in a color managed workflow any more.

Here are the settings I have for NX2's color management:



As I said Photo Mechanic displays the image properly as do other browsers like FastStone Image Viewer. What have I missed in my NX2 settings?

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

  

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23rd Dec 2009
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
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Reply message Problem still not addressed
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22nd Feb 2010
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
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23rd Feb 2010
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
24th Feb 2010
36
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26th Feb 2010
37
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
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02nd Mar 2010
46
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
02nd Mar 2010
47
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58
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
12th Mar 2010
59
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20th Mar 2010
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21st Mar 2010
61
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23rd Mar 2010
62
Reply message Finally, I have a fix
TiggerGTO Silver Member
21st Sep 2010
63
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
21st Sep 2010
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TiggerGTO Silver Member
21st Sep 2010
65
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21st Sep 2010
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gol4man
21st Sep 2010
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21st Sep 2010
68
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TiggerGTO Silver Member
21st Sep 2010
69
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gol4man
21st Sep 2010
70
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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014
21st Sep 2010
71
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12th Nov 2010
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greyface Gold Member Nikonian since 30th Jul 2008Wed 23-Dec-09 09:51 PM
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#1. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 0


Acushnet, US
          

Have you tried the Adobe RGB (1998) profile?

-------------------
"On no account allow a Vogon to read poetry at you." - The Hitchhikers Guide

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 24-Dec-09 02:07 PM
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#2. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 1
Thu 24-Dec-09 04:24 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

Here is a sample picture that I opened in NX2 and then did Edit->Duplicate twice. The version on the left is the way it originally opens in ProPhoto RGB. The version in the middle is with the profile converted to sRGB. The version on the right is with the profile converted to Adobe RGB. The profile conversion is the only difference between these three duplicate images, and the screen shot is of the multiple duplicates opened at the same time in one NX2 session.

The colors on the sRGB appear to be closest to correct. There appears to be something broken with NX2's color management on my installation on my Windows 7 upgraded machine. I have opened a problem with Nikon tech support. In the mean time, I might try completely uninstalling NX2 and reinstalling it on this machine.



Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina


Attachment #1, (jpg file)

  

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F1 Fan Registered since 13th Jan 2007Thu 24-Dec-09 02:49 PM
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#3. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 2


St. Louis, US
          

I wonder if there is an update for the i1 Display software for W7 or perhaps the video card.

Again, just a guess.

Mark,
www.MarkHornePhotography.com

Life is short. Live it as an Exclamation, not an Explanation.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 24-Dec-09 04:17 PM
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#4. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 3
Thu 24-Dec-09 04:18 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

The color was off after the Windows 7 update using the default monitor profile. I recalibrated with the i1 Display 2, and the before/after display in the calibration software looked good. It did not help with NX2's rendering though. I'll also repeat here that viewing the files with Photo Mechanic looks good. If I toggle off PM's color management setting, the color looks quite similar to what NX2 is showing.

Is anybody else running NX2 on Windows 7, and if so are you having problems with images in non-sRGB color spaces?

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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F1 Fan Registered since 13th Jan 2007Thu 24-Dec-09 05:54 PM
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#5. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 4


St. Louis, US
          

What settings are you using in the "Color Management" tab with PM?


Mark,
www.MarkHornePhotography.com

Life is short. Live it as an Exclamation, not an Explanation.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 24-Dec-09 06:55 PM
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#6. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 5


Apex, US
          

Rather than posting a screen shot, I'll list the simple PM color management options:

Default ICC profile if undetermined: sRGB IEC61966-2.1
Color Manage thumbnails for display: checked
Color Manage previews for display: checked
Embed ICC profile into Camera JPGs during copy: not checked

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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F1 Fan Registered since 13th Jan 2007Thu 24-Dec-09 07:12 PM
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#7. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 6


St. Louis, US
          

I sure wish I could help further. From what you have provided, it sounds like NX2 and W7 are not playing well together. I hate when stuff like this happens. Both parties blame the other and some where down the road one of them releases an update to fix things.

Good luck Danny.

Mark,
www.MarkHornePhotography.com

Life is short. Live it as an Exclamation, not an Explanation.

  

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hrbaan Registered since 29th Oct 2005Thu 24-Dec-09 07:40 PM
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#8. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 2


Kockengen, NL
          

Perhaps a silly question, but did you convert or apply the sRGB and aRGB colour spaces on the two copies?

I necessary, let me have a look at the (raw) files to see if anything is wrong with them.

Cheers,


Hayo Baan – Photography
e-mail: info@hayobaan.nl
Web: http://www.hayobaan.nl

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 24-Dec-09 08:02 PM
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#9. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 8
Thu 24-Dec-09 08:04 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

I used convert to profile for both copies. To reiterate, I am opening files that I looked fine with NX2 on this machine before upgrading to Windows 7. I have NX2 set up to use ProPhoto RGB. The image looks the worst when I first open it in NX2 and the colorspace is ProPhoto RGB. It looks best when I use convert to profile to change it to sRGB. I'll be happy to send you a raw file if you'd like, but I'm quite certain that the problem has something to do with NX2 and W7 not playing well together regarding color management.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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hrbaan Registered since 29th Oct 2005Thu 24-Dec-09 08:12 PM
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#10. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 9


Kockengen, NL
          

Danny,

Wierd stuff! Something is definitely wrong in the combination of the two. I guess you already upgraded to the latest version of NX2 (2.2.4), this version is the first to be compatible with Windows 7. If you haven't upgraded yet, this may be the problem, otherwise I'm at a loss and other than a video driver problem or a (rare) incompatibility issue, I can't suggest anything now.

(I'm on a Mac and eagerly awaiting Nikon to update NX2 to Snow Leopard; the current version crashes every now and then...)

Cheers,


Hayo Baan – Photography
e-mail: info@hayobaan.nl
Web: http://www.hayobaan.nl

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Fri 25-Dec-09 01:33 AM
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#11. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 0


Apex, US
          

In case any body cares, I uninstalled and reinstalled NX2. No improvement was seen.

Isn't there anybody else running NX2 on Windows 7? If so, are you seeing this problem? If not, please describe your color management settings.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Fri 25-Dec-09 09:52 AM
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#12. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 11


San Jose, US
          

Danny I am running Nx2with Win 7 64 bit and I just got a new calibrator as my old one was so old, i couldnot get drivers for it. I now have an X-Rite colorMunki and used it the other day to calibrate my monitor. My settings in NX2 are pretty much like yours and I ahve absolutely no problems with any of my images.I just posted a number ofthemtonight.I use the Adobe RGB space, not sRGB or your color space. NX2 2.2.4 works very well with my setup.Make sure that yournew calibration is actually selected.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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hrbaan Registered since 29th Oct 2005Fri 25-Dec-09 10:14 AM
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#13. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 0


Kockengen, NL
          

Definitely a problem with Windows 7 and NX2 here. I had a look at the original NEF file Danny sent me and to me the image resembles the one "in the middle" (i.e., the one that was converted to sRGB). For me the difference between the image in ProPhoto, or with a conversion to sRGB or aRGB all look (almost) exactly the same, as it should be.

The images Danny showed, all look as if they got sRGB applied to them. This leads me to suspect that Windows Colour management (or the video driver) is applying sRGB on top of the output of NX2.

Do you suffer this problem in any other program? Save the NEF file as TIF with the original converted to the three different profiles. Open these in a different (colour managed) program and see what gives.

Cheers,


Hayo Baan – Photography
e-mail: info@hayobaan.nl
Web: http://www.hayobaan.nl

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Fri 25-Dec-09 04:57 PM
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#14. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 13
Fri 25-Dec-09 05:08 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

Ok... this appears to be isolated to NX2 on W7. I am running NX2 2.2.4. I even tried uninstalling NX2, Picture Control Utility and the Message Center and reinstalling all of it.

I used NX2 to create three TIFs in the color spaces ProPhoto RGB, sRGB and Adobe RGB. I saved them and embedded the color profile in each. When I view the thumbnails for these TIFs in PhotoMechanic, they display correctly. If I turn off PM's color management, they look like they do in NX2. Next I tried opening the TIFs in CS4. I have the working color space set to ProPhoto RGB and have the warnings turned on for when a file gets opened that does not match the working color space. As expected, the ProPhoto RGB TIF opened without any warnings. The other two displayed the mismatch dialog and both times I selected to use the embedded profile.

In all of the screen shots below, the order of the images from left to right is ProPhoto RGB, sRGB and Adobe RGB.

Here is NX2 displaying the three TIFs:


Nere is Photo Mechanic with color management turned on:


Here is Photo Mechanic with color management turned off:


And finally, here is CS4 using the embedded profiles:


Based on these screen captures, I would have to say that NX2 is rendering all of the images (NEF or TIF) presented to it as if they are sRGB even when they are in a different color space with the correct profile embedded.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)
Attachment #3, (jpg file)
Attachment #4, (jpg file)

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Sat 26-Dec-09 08:35 AM
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#15. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 14
Sat 26-Dec-09 08:36 AM by robsb

San Jose, US
          

Danny I need to correct my earlier comment. I do not have NX2 set to automatically convert a file to my default color space which is Adobe RGB. I only process RAW 14 bit files in NX2 and if I move a TIFF to CS4 it is always a 16 bit TIFF. In no case do my images show any color shift, even when I convert to sRGB 8 bit for the web in CS4. I have all the latest Win 7 64 bit drivers for my monitor and my video card and assume you do also. So I have to assume it is either in your use of ProPhoto not playing nice with Win 7 64 bit and the NX2 combo.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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DPower Gold Member Nikonian since 02nd Jun 2004Sat 26-Dec-09 10:39 AM
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#16. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 15


Fayetteville, US
          

FWIW - I have Win7 64 bit running NX2. I can't see any color shifts from my saved photos. I opened several in both NX2 and PSCS4 to check. My monitor was calibrated with a Spyder pro.
Is your profiled setting loading on start-up?

DP

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sat 26-Dec-09 01:00 PM
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#17. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 16


Apex, US
          

Yes, my monitor profile is loading on start up, but it is not a calibration problem. The screen shots from NX2 and two other applications show that NX2 (at least my installation on W7) is not rendering the colors correctly unless the color space is sRGB. Photo Mechanic and Photoshop CS4 are both rendering the colors correctly in all three of the color spaces I've checked -- ProPhoto RGB, sRGB and Adobe RGB.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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mburke Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Dec 2004Sat 26-Dec-09 01:56 PM
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#18. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 17


Rhinelander, US
          

I tried to convert to some different profiles and the pictures would show the changes when I used some of the more obscure profiles, like a printer profile. However I noticed that Adobe rgb1998 wasn't listed. It's like some of the profiles didn't transfer when I upgraded to Win 7 and NX2.24. I couldn't fine Pro Foto either. Check if all the profiles are in the proper place on Win7. I searched the help menu for "color profiles" and it told me how to install them properly. Could be there not in the right place.

Mike

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sat 26-Dec-09 06:08 PM
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#19. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 18


Apex, US
          

I believe that the profiles are installed correctly on Windows 7; otherwise, I wouldn't be able to see them as choices in any of the applications.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sun 27-Dec-09 02:40 PM
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#20. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 0


Apex, US
          

As a minor update, I got a response from Nikon Technical support stating that they have forwarded my issue to the QC group. I have updated my case with Nikon to include a link to this thread since this particular forum is listed as open.

One more thing... This thread prompted me to try opening the TIFs I generated yesterday in Windows Photo Viewer. All three images look the same in that program. I am firmly convinced this is an NX2 problem. It might be isolated to my particular installation, but it is an NX2 specific problem.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sun 27-Dec-09 03:04 PM
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#21. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 20


Apex, US
          

One more update... I just tried opening the three TIFs on my desktop which is also running NX2 2.2.4, but it is still running Vista Ultimate. NX2 renders the color correctly on all three versions of the TIF on that machine.

So, it appears that the problem is isolated to NX2 on W7 or possibly it is a problem isolated to my specific installation. As I said previously, I have tried uninstalling and reinstalling NX2 but that didn't help.

I sure hope that Nikon's tech support will be able to figure something out. I bought and setup this laptop specifically for photo editing and it will be a major pain if my primary workflow (NX2 in ProPhoto RGB) is broken on this machine.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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DPower Gold Member Nikonian since 02nd Jun 2004Sun 27-Dec-09 07:40 PM
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#22. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 21


Fayetteville, US
          

Danny - When you tried uninstalling and reinstalling NX2, did you look at your HD and delete the files and folders from the previous install? The uninstall program does not remove everything. Might be worth a try.

DP

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sun 27-Dec-09 07:55 PM
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#23. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 22
Sun 27-Dec-09 08:14 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

No, I didn't do that. I simply uninstalled and reinstalled. It's worth trying it again.

Edit: I uninstalled and checked the install path. The uninstall did in fact remove all of the files in "C:\Program Files (x86)\Nikon\Capture NX 2". The "Nikon\Capture NX 2" directory was still there, so I removed it and the Nikon directory. I rebooted for good measure and reinstalled. The problem is still there.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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DPower Gold Member Nikonian since 02nd Jun 2004Tue 29-Dec-09 08:31 PM
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#24. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 23


Fayetteville, US
          

Danny - I processed some raw files with NX2. They looked as expected.
I then opened the files in PSCS4 and tried to change the color to sRGB. While the profile window was open, the profile seemed to be accepted, but when I closed the profile window, the photos returned to the look the orginally had. I have had this happen before. I might have the same issue as you. I'm going to try some more shots today.
(Win7 64, PSCS4-64, NX2)

DP

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Fri 01-Jan-10 12:56 PM
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#25. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 0


Rochester, US
          

Danny: I am late to this post, but simply wish to add my own uneventful experience with NX2 and Win 7. I run a Dell T5400 with Win7 64 bit, and loaded NX2 v 2.2.4. Color mgmt settings are similar to yours except that I am using Nikon Adobe RGB (while also checking the box for using this profile instead of the embedded one), a different printer profile for my E 3800, and Relative Colorimetric for Intent. There is another post regrading installation--"Howto use Capture NX2 with Windows 7 x64" and that is close to what I did getting started. I have not witnessed any untoward nuances with color rendition at all.
Happy new year
Gary

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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guystooges Silver Member Nikonian since 28th May 2009Sat 02-Jan-10 11:32 AM
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#26. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 25
Sat 02-Jan-10 11:34 AM by guystooges

Fortuna, US
          

Hi Danny

I have a Win 7 Pro x64 system using an ATI 1Gb 4850 with (2) i1 Display 2 calibrated 27" monitors. No color management problems are happening like you've described above. That goes for both the 2.2.3 and 2.2.4 versions of Capture NX. My system was also upgraded from Vista Ultimate using the 'Custom' option during the Windows 7 installation. This did not preserve any of the programs, settings, etc. that were on my Vista build during the migration.

Here are a few 'out there' items to consider that I have not seen mentioned earlier in this post...

What upgrade path did you take and did you consider that possibly there was a problem in the Vista-to-7 upgrade that might be playing a part in your current problems? Is your OS 32bit or 64bit?

What type video chipset does your laptop use? Have you updated to the latest Win7 drivers for your video card and made sure that they came from the manufacture and not from Windows update?

Is there a newer northbridge/southbridge chipset driver package for your laptop available from the manufacture? Likewise, is there a new BIOS for it too? My system's motherboard design is 5 years old now and the last OS related BIOS update for it was 2 years ago for Vista's release. Windows 7 is just different enough that I cannot use the sleep function (working in Vista) and Windows reports a BIOS incompatibility. Perhaps something like this is going on with your system?

Have you looked in Control panel's Color Management section and familiarized yourself with it? Maybe something there is out-of-wack as a result of the Vista-to-7 upgrade?

Do you have ViewNX installed and does it exhibit the same problems you're experiencing with Capture NX? I ran into the 'green cast' problem with ViewNX v1.5 on Win7 and had to move to v1.4 to correct the issue.

While I realize that these are all long shots with trying to resolve your described problems, I felt it could not hurt to bring them up!

- Good Luck -

guystooges

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Sat 02-Jan-10 01:37 PM
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#27. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 26


Rochester, US
          

There are all useful considerations. I had an odd problem with another Dell 5400 Win7 remake in the workplace. One oddity was a problem failing to fully refresh Windows Explorer following simple file deletions, and similar seemingly unrelated matters. The denominator turned out to be my older but fancy Nvidia display/graphics card. There are idiosyncrasies in all new systems, and Win7 has and will continue to show similar nuisances along the way. Updates may or may not work.
Incidentally, My Win 7 build was done with a completely fresh start--no upgrades, overlays, blah blah. Everything I needed was backed up and restored later. I have found over the years that this method is ultimately the safest and least troublesome--no hidden gremlins.

cheers
Gary

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sat 02-Jan-10 05:43 PM
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#28. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 26
Sat 02-Jan-10 06:13 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

My laptop is a Lenovo W500D. I used the regular upgrade path from the Windows 7 upgrade installer from Lenovo to go from 64-bit Vista Professional to 64-bit Windows 7 Professional. Part of the Lenovo update instructions is to install a utility called Active Update. This utility checks and updates all drivers and BIOS. When I ran Active Update after upgrading to Windows 7, it updated 8-10 drivers and the BIOS. I just ran it again for grins and there was another BIOS update which I installed.

Edited to add: my graphic chipset is the ATI Mobility FireGL V5700, and I have verified that I have the latest drivers from Lenovo installed. I am using a monitor profile that I created with my i1 Display 2 after upgrading to W7. The NX2 color problems showed both before and after monitor calbiration. I have played with the settings on the advanced tab for Windows color management, but can not see any differences in the way NX2 behaves. If there are specific settings you think I should check, please let me know. Here's a screenshot of the advanced tab.



As I said above, I have created three TIFs of the same image with the profile converted to ProPhoto RGB, sRGB and Adobe RGB (with embedded profiles). Photo Mechanic, Adobe Bridge, Adobe Photoshop and Windows Photo Viewer all display these TIFs correctly. I have not been using View NX, but based on your post, I installed it. The thumbnails do not appear to be color managed, but when I view each of the TIFs, they do display correctly. The color appears correct and I can not detect any change when I switch between the three images in the viewer.

So, I am quite convinced that this problem is restricted to NX2 on my laptop. Since others can not recreate the problem it must be an installation problem. I have uninstalled and reinstalled NX2 multiple times, including deleting the program directories and rebooting. I guess I have to wait patiently for Nikon service to respond to the problem I opened with them. I'm not holding my breath though because previous experience with Nikon for software service has been quite disappointing and frustrating.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

  

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guystooges Silver Member Nikonian since 28th May 2009Sun 03-Jan-10 12:44 AM
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#29. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 28


Fortuna, US
          

I've tried to familiarize myself with the WD500 a little bit today. This model has something called 'switchable graphics mode' and 'discrete graphics mode' and I am not familiar with these options. See more here...
http://forums.lenovo.com/t5/W-Series-ThinkPad-Laptops/Help-W500-graphics-card-question/m-p/68825
Which are you using, Danny?

See pg 34 in this thread regarding having high performance mode turned on...
http://forums.lenovo.com/t5/W-Series-ThinkPad-Laptops/Help-W500-graphics-card-question/td-p/48350

Do you have a virtualization product like VirtualBox installed? I'm thinking you might be able to get Windows 7 going on it (a free for 90 days ISO is available from MS), install CaptureNX 2.2.4, and then check to see if the color management works there.

guystooges

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sun 03-Jan-10 03:56 PM
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#30. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 29


Apex, US
          

Wow... thanks so much for digging into this for me. You have actually hit on something. To make a long story short, it appears that the NX2 color rendering problem is directly related to using the high performance mode. When I switch into energy saving mode, NX2 renders the colors correctly.

Now for more details:

My W500 is a model with switchable graphics. My understanding of switchable graphics is that the laptop has an ATI desktop grade graphics subsystem along with the regular Intel chipset on the motherboard. The ATI graphics give much better performance, the Intel chipset uses much less energy, so you can switch depending on your needs. To switch, you right click on the battery icon in the task bar and one of the choices is Switchable Graphics with the choices being "Energy Saving" or "High Performance".

The high performance mode was in fact turned on. I do not know if it was turned on before I upgraded to Windows 7. I tried switching to the power saving mode, and guess what... NX2 is able to render the colors correctly again. It is quite obvious that I need to recalibrate again to create another monitor profile for the energy saving mode because the color is a bit off. But, NX2 displays all three TIFs (ProPhoto RGB, sRGB, Adobe RGB) the same in energy saving mode.

The problem is that high performance mode is one of the reasons I bought the model that I did. The performance difference between the two modes is quite apparent when you look for it. One of the easiest examples is to use the bird's eye panning mode in Photoshop. For those that don't know what this feature is, I'll try to describe it.

If you are zoomed into 100%, you are only seeing a portion of the image on the screen. If you press and hold H to activate the hand tool and then start to drag the picture, the image zooms out to fit the entire image in the display and there is a rectangle drawn to show the current view position. Dragging moves the rectangle. When you release the mouse button, Photoshop zooms back into 100% view. When the high performance graphics are turned on, the zoom in/out is very quick and smooth. When energy saving graphics are turned on the zoom in/out is a bit jerky.

Note, NX2 has a similar feature, but it is just implemented differently. It has a Bird's Eye window that is over with the edit list and histogram. You can drag the little rectangle around in the bird's eye window to navigate around the image when you are zoomed in.

Thanks to you, I have a real and usable work around for the NX2 color management problem I was experiencing. NX2 appears to be the only software that is not working correctly in high performance graphics mode. I can turn it off to get the colors to render correctly. I will update my problem report with Nikon so they can hopefully zero in on the problem. I would prefer to turn on high performance mode and leave it on, especially when I am running with A/C power, which is a majority of the time.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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guystooges Silver Member Nikonian since 28th May 2009Mon 04-Jan-10 01:03 AM
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#31. "RE: Color management for NX2 on Windows 7"
In response to Reply # 30


Fortuna, US
          

This the fantastic news! I like to bird-dog these type of problems and am glad that the effort paid off. Hopefully Nikon can come up with a patch for this glitch on their next Capture NX update release.

guystooges

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Mon 22-Feb-10 12:35 PM
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#32. "Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 0


Apex, US
          

I don't know if anybody still cares about this issue except for me, but I thought I'd post a follow-up. I have gone back and forth with Nikon Service for over 9 weeks now and am quite disappointed with the results. I have posted the attached screen capture to the problem report. In the last update the Nikon contact said that the developers in Japan are claiming this is a hardware problem. This screenshot shows Windows Photo Viewer across the top, NX2 across the middle and Photoshop CS4 across the bottom. I edited the same NEF multiple times and converted to different profiles. Across each row is ProPhoto RGB, sRGB, Adobe RGB and Nikon's version of sRGB. In this single screen capture, you can clearly see that Nikon is rendering the sky with noticeable color shifts for the different profiles. ProPhoto RGB looks almost purple. If I switch my laptop to use power saving graphics instead of high performance, the NX2 renderings are almost identical. I have told Nikon Support that I am willing to test things for them if they would give me instructions. Surely they have some debug information that could be turned on or they could build a special version to send me.



I really like NX2, and it is a major piece of my post-processing workflow. This poor service and disappointments with previous service contacts make me wonder if I will continue with NX2 when it comes time to spend more money on the next version.

If anybody has any contacts with people inside Nikon or Nik, it would be great if this problem could be brought to their attention. If anybody has contact information they could give me that is outside the regular NikonTech channel, I'd appreciate the information.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina


Attachment #1, (jpg file)

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Tue 23-Feb-10 03:55 AM
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#33. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 32


San Jose, US
          

Danny perhaps Nikon is correct in that it is a hardware problem. Have you asked ATI what is different in their implementation of the hi speed mode vs the low power mode? Is there anything in that implementation that could impact color space? Did you ever try doing two calibrations like you said in a previous post to see if that helps in any way? I use an ATI video card on my desktop and it has the ability to create many configurations that can impact how colors are rendered. I have never touched them and have only used the standard settings color corrected with a ColorMunki. I have no color management issues.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Tue 23-Feb-10 06:05 PM
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#34. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 33


Apex, US
          

I've been busy lately with non-photography stuff and have not had a chance to do the dual calibration that I intend to do. However, I don't understand how this can be a hardware issue. If you look at the capture I posted yesterday, you can see that on the single screen, Windows Photo Viewer and Photoshop CS4 are displaying the 4 versions of the image almost identically while NX2 has very noticeable color shifts. If it was truly a hardware problem, I would expect to see similar color shifts in all the color managed applications. Photo Mechanic's viewer is also color managed, and it displays the images correctly. It just didn't lend itself to opening multiple windows simultaneously. So, I have tried 3 applications that get it right and NX2 gets it wrong. Do you still think it is a hardware issue? I'm not trying to argue, I'm just very frustrated by this situation.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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FrankSRGB Silver Member Nikonian since 09th Aug 2009Tue 23-Feb-10 07:56 PM
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#35. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 34


US
          

On the other hand, when you switch into energy saving mode NX2 renders the colors correctly. So how could it be NX2?

One interpretation points to hardware, the other to NX.

I use a Lenovo T500, also with an ATI card. On XP my battery icon gives me access to Lenovo's Power Manager settings. Have you verified that the setting change you make from the battery icon also appears in ATI's utility (Catalyst Control Center on my T500)? In the utility is a Power Play section that has the same settings you are using Power Manager to edit. You would think that when one changes the other would too, but ya never know.

You might also want to check your BIOS Display settings at boot time. On my T500 there's settings in there for the Graphics Device (where you can select Discrete Graphics) and one to enable/disable OS Detection for Switchable Graphics.

I know it's a long shot, but I hope you're lucky enough to find something amiss. I don't envy your predicament.

Regards,
Frank

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Wed 24-Feb-10 01:38 AM
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#36. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 34


San Jose, US
          

Of course I don't know the answer to your question. I am just pointing out that ATI has many customizable settings when you use power modes and one of these settings may be conflicting with NX2. Since none of us are seeing your problem and I have CS4 also, it has to be something unique to your configuration and since from your posts you don't seem to have anything set differently in your SW preferences than we do and NX2 does work in the low power mode, logic says it has to be in the power mode implementation and how it relates to NX2. That is why I suggested that you also contact ATI to find out what might be happening. Nikon should also tell you if they are looking at any particular HW setting to set their Color Management. ATI lets you change the effects of color management in their control windows.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Fri 26-Feb-10 07:42 AM
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#37. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 34


Solingen, DE
          

Using a test picture in a special color space designed to check if an application is color space aware, I could reproduce the behavior on my Lenovo T400. Capture NX2 does not convert the working calor space to the display color space when using the high performance mode. When using the power saving mode the conversion does work. View NX works in both modes. I think I'm going to open a call with Nikon Germany.


Wolfgang

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Fri 26-Feb-10 09:20 AM
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#38. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 37


San Jose, US
          

Wolfgang an interesting observation. It is surprising that Nikon got it right for View NX and not NX2. Danny should be happy that you found the cause.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Fri 26-Feb-10 08:46 PM
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#39. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 38
Fri 26-Feb-10 09:12 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

Yes, I am happy to have somebody corroborate my problem report. If you open a defect, you can refer to mine. The incident number is 091223-001945. As you can see from the first part of the number, I opened my defect on December 23, 2009.

Is your special image a color wheel with the colors labeled in German where the words don't match the colors unless you view it with a color managed application? I found a file I have saved as GermanColorWheel.jpg that I must have saved from a previous exchange with you or somebody else on Nikonians. I didn't think to try this image, but I will now.

Edit: I just tried GermanColorWheel.jpg assuming this is the file you are talking about (whether or not I renamed it). As expected, NX2 renders it correctly when the graphics are in power saving mode and incorrectly when the graphics are in high performance mode.

Please do open a defect of your own. Maybe Nikon will believe me now.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Sat 27-Feb-10 12:37 PM
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#40. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 39


Solingen, DE
          

The test file is probably the one you refer to. The name I have is RainBow_cs_mini.jpg.

I have opened a call at Nikon Germany and added your incident number.


Wolfgang

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sat 27-Feb-10 01:30 PM
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#41. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 40
Mon 01-Mar-10 01:16 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

Since I didn't know the source of the funky color wheel jpg, I searched the web and found something very similar at:
www.gballard.net/psd/go_live_page_profile/embeddedJPEGprofiles.html

(Edit: my original post used the link syntax, but for some reason, the link got changed from ".../embeddedJPGprofiles.html" to "dedJPGProfiles.html". Hopefully the link above will work properly now.)

It has a pair of jpgs in a roll over where one is the funky color space, and the other is an sRGB image with the colors wrong. When you roll your mouse over the jpg, the funky one show. If you have a color managed browser, the colors are correct when you mouse over the picture. If your browser is not color managed, the colors are wrong whether you are mousing over the image or not.

Here is the funky jpg that should display properly for a color managed application:


I made two more screenshots with this funky jpg. In this first one, Capture NX2 and ViewNX are displaying the image in power saving graphics mode:



In this second screenshot, both applications are displaying the image in high performance graphics mode:



ViewNX, the free program, is 4 for 4. Capture NX2 is 1 for 4. I updated my problem report with Nikon.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina


Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Sun 28-Feb-10 05:31 PM
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#42. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 40


Rochester, US
          

Thanks wolfgang and Danny.
The tutorial link did not seem to work. I'd be interested to do these same tests, and presumably this last post and its images are derived from the tutorial. Danny, can you post that link once again?
Cheers

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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Robp Gold Member Nikonian since 23rd Oct 2009Sun 28-Feb-10 08:25 PM
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#43. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 42


Gainesville, US
          

The last part of Danny's link just got a little munged. Here's a corrected link.

www.gballard.net/psd/go_live_page_profile/embeddedJPEGprofiles.html

I'm following the thread pretty closely because I think it may help with some minor problems I'm seeing in NX2. Thanks for pursuing this, Danny.

Rob

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Mon 01-Mar-10 01:19 PM
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#44. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 43


Apex, US
          

I edited my previous post to correct the link. It was correct in my post (even when I edited it), but the link tag wasn't handled correctly by the Nikonians forum software. I don't know if the URL was too long or what. I changed it to a straight URL which seems to work now, plus I fixed a couple typos that I noticed.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Mon 01-Mar-10 05:11 PM
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#45. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 44


Rochester, US
          

Thanks, folks.
Danny: How did you download that useful mouse-over image above? I could not seem to find it or find a means of saving the image in such a way that it works to illustrate the color management glitches.

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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dsouleles Silver Member Nikonian since 07th Mar 2009Tue 02-Mar-10 04:26 AM
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#46. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 45


Great Falls, US
          

Interesting - I downloaded the test image from the post above. It looks appropriately color managed in Windows 7 Explorer and Photo Mechanic as well as ViewNx. In Capture NX2 it is NOT color managed in the Browser workspace, but it IS color managed in the Edit workspace. This is on two different machines - one a desktop, the other a laptop - both running Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit. Neither one has ATI graphics.

Dean

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Visit my Nikonians gallery.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Tue 02-Mar-10 07:29 AM
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#47. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 46


San Jose, US
          

It is a known fact that the NX2 browser is not color managed, I have no idea why.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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guystooges Silver Member Nikonian since 28th May 2009Sat 06-Mar-10 12:42 PM
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#48. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 39


Fortuna, US
          

Danny

I just had a thought. Does the laptop you are having the NX2 color Management trouble with have the capability to connect an external monitor? If so, have you tried that to see if the problem appears there too? You might cycle though any option(s) the laptop has for running the external monitor currently with the laptop screen or with the external only and the laptop screen disabled and see if any difference is found.

guystooges

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Mon 08-Mar-10 12:02 PM
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#49. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 48


Apex, US
          

I haven't even connected an external monitor to this laptop since getting it. One reason is that I'm quite pleased with the display for general photo editing. If I need to ensure accurate color, I move to my desktop. The other reason is that I would need to get a special connector to connect to the mini-DVI port. The final reason is that I believe I have proved without doubt that NX2 has a bug when working in high performance graphics mode on this family of laptops.

The most recent screenshot showing both NX2 and ViewNX proves that NX2 is only managing the color correctly in power saving mode. Interestingly, it has been been 10 days since I last updated my problem report at Nikon tech support with this latest information. I haven't even gotten an acknowledgment.

I have worked in software support and know how difficult it can be to debug problems in customer's environments. I've offered to gather any debug information they would need or run special versions if provided to gather debug information. However, the programmers have not even admitted that there is a problem. I have the distinct impression that they consider this issue closed. I don't, but I'm not sure what else I can do about it.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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Robp Gold Member Nikonian since 23rd Oct 2009Mon 08-Mar-10 02:09 PM
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#50. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 49


Gainesville, US
          

Danny,

Although your problem appears to be associated with your computer's power management it is, at heart, a color rendition issue. I have color rendition problems with NX2 not interacting properly with Epson's 3880 print driver. Image previews shown by the driver have a strong magenta cast which does not show in NX2 editing or soft proofing mode or in the final print. When the same print drivers are invoked from Photoshop they preview perfectly implying that NX2 is the culprit.

I've seen other problems with Nikon software products not handling color rendition properly. Apparently, it is documented that Nikon View does not color manage. I think all of these color problems are related so I have stated that to Nikon in an update to my open Incident Report (Nikon calls it a Question Reference #) and have passed on your Incident Number to them.

Here is a copy of the message I sent to Nikon: Just thought I'd update you by noting that many other NX2 users have commented on various internet forums that they are experiencing numerous color rendering problems with the product. In particular, "Danny" has been attempting to get his problems reviewed by Nikon with no success after a very long wait. I suspect that these problems are related so it might be helpful to collect the data from all cases related to color rendition and review them for multiple pointers to a solution. Danny's Nikon Incident Number is 091223-001945."

My Nikon Question Reference # is 100201-00146. Maybe, if all Nikonians with open dialog with Nikon will refer to other User's color-related problems, we could get them (Nikon) to acknowledge a "generalized" color problem and seriously address it. To that end, other Users, please let us know your Question Reference Numbers.

Hope this helps Danny,

Rob

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sevtcard Silver Member Nikonian since 05th Mar 2009Mon 08-Mar-10 05:12 PM
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#51. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 49
Mon 08-Mar-10 05:21 PM by sevtcard

US
          

i first contacted them about memory issues and crashes using NX2 2.2.4 in January...my last communication with them was almost 2 weeks ago. i think they are having some very significant problems with this most recent build - they've gotten a lot of information from me on machine settings, etc, and have asked for actual pictures edited with NX2...so your problem is probably somewhere in a very deep stack of problems they are having, especially in view of an impending 3.0 version.

R Mark Burke
www.broadwallphotography.com

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Tue 09-Mar-10 11:24 AM
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#52. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 51


Solingen, DE
          

Nikon Germany support told me that there are a lot of requests pending, so it will take some time until my request will be processed.

Today I made a NX2 color management test with two other systems with ATI grafics:

HP DC 7900 + ATI Radeon HD3650
Sumsung R522 + ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4300

Both worked with color managemnt. So it seems not to be a general ATI grafics problem.

Wolfgang

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Wed 10-Mar-10 01:02 PM
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#53. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 52


Solingen, DE
          

Update: Nikon Europe Support informed me, that my request was forwarded to Nikon software development.


Wolfgang

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 11-Mar-10 12:39 PM
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#54. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 53


Apex, US
          

Don't hold your breath abotu software development doing anything. The initial service contact who handled my "question" forwarded information to the developers in Japan several times. The lastest update from them is that they can't recreate the problem, so they don't plan to do anything else. They ignore offers from me to collect additional debug information or run special versions of the executables if they would provide them. Obviously, this is related to a specific graphics chipset or the related drivers related, so it is no surprise they can not recreate the problem on different hardware.

I have been a software developer for over 30 years, including doing software service. This lack of support would not be tolerated by my company or any of our customers. This experience and the way they have handled previous problems reported to them have given me some severe reservations about upgrading to NX3 whenever it comes out. In the past, I experienced the "memory leak" in a bad way on Vista, but because I was running 64-bit they wouldn't even investigate. Now it is quite apparent that the memory leak was not specific to running on a 64-bit system.

As a last ditch effort, I tried opening a problem report with Nik. I explained that I understand Capture NX2 support is handled by Nikon, but I was hoping to find somebody in Nik that cared that future sales of their product were possibly being impacted by poor service.

Most people who know me through Nikonians will hopefully agree that I try very hard to avoid posting negative comments; however, this situation has really irked me.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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sevtcard Silver Member Nikonian since 05th Mar 2009Thu 11-Mar-10 12:57 PM
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#55. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 54


US
          

makes one wonder if nikon is giving up on the product altogether...

R Mark Burke
www.broadwallphotography.com

  

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Robp Gold Member Nikonian since 23rd Oct 2009Thu 11-Mar-10 06:05 PM
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#56. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 53


Gainesville, US
          

Another update; I just received this message in response to my adding Danny's Incident Report # to my ongoing Incident Report: "The issue has been reported to the software developers in Japan."

This appears to me, at least, to be an acknowledgement by Nikon USA support that a real problem exist with color management in NX2.

Rob

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Thu 11-Mar-10 11:12 PM
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#57. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 56


Apex, US
          

Most software service organizations have a one or more levels of service. The intent is that you have people with general overall knowledge of the product responsible for answering the phone or handling the problem queue. This also allows the developers to work on code in the new release instead of tracking down problems and answering questions all the time.

This update simply means that the person watching the queue doesn't have an answer readily available and had to punt to the next level. Depending on how large and deep the service organization is the next level may be the actual developers who wrote the code or an organization of developers who are tasked with debugging problems and providing fixes.

Don't take the fact that the incident was forwarded to the developers as an acknowledgment by Nikon USA that there is a problem. It just means the first line of service doesn't know how to address the problem.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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Robp Gold Member Nikonian since 23rd Oct 2009Fri 12-Mar-10 12:38 AM
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#58. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 57


Gainesville, US
          

I basically agree with you Danny; in fact, I almost always know a lot more than the first 15-20 telephone answerers (notice I did not say helpers) I have to contend with. On the other hand, I finally got the less-than-helpful obstructionist at Adobe to bump my 3-month old problem up in the PS CS4 support group and the next level actually listened to me, was polite, and solved the problem in 15 minutes over the phone. And guess what, it definitely was a difficult, arcane, mysterious-to-me interaction with the OS. I usually wind up solving my own problems but would not have fixed this.

Of course, the fact that I got into a verbal give and take helped tremendously because each participant can feed off the others insights. The email back and forth is a poor model for problem solving except when screen captures are helpful, to wit, your responses to Nikon. Anyway I hope this moves forward.

Rob

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Fri 12-Mar-10 03:04 AM
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#59. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 57


San Jose, US
          

Danny my short experience in the commercial world vs the Defense industry when it comes to Sw is that while the Gov't insists on detailed planning and numerous reports along with fixes of all SW bugs before release (read that as known bugs as you never get all bugs), the Commercial world is marketing driven and builds are delivered per marketing plan even if known bugs exist. The plan is to fix those bugs with the very next release if possible, but I have seen bugs live a very long life depending on how many people were complaining. So in your case I am not surprised that you have not received the attention you should for as you say, it appears to be specific to hardware that you have and it is not a general populace problem, though some people have duplicated it on other hardware. So the answer has to be that everyone with the problem has to post a fix request to get the proper attention.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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gol4man Registered since 11th Jul 2006Sat 20-Mar-10 06:42 PM
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#60. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 59


Jupiter, US
          

I had a problemm once on my old XP computer. My pictures looked awful no matter what I did after I did an update to NX2. The way I solved it was by doing a Spyder Color calibration. As soon as I did that the colors all came back to what i had been seeing. I just got a new Windows 7 computer and so far all the photos look great on my monitor. I did nothing but hook up the computer and hooked up the monitor I had. Try to calibrate your monitor and see what happens. I think that as soon as you use that color space it might fix the problem.

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Sun 21-Mar-10 04:25 PM
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#61. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 60
Sun 21-Mar-10 04:26 PM by TiggerGTO

Apex, US
          

Thanks for the suggestion, but as I said in this post, one of the first things I tried to remedy this problem was a recalibration with my i1 Display 2. It is not a calibration problem.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Tue 23-Mar-10 04:33 PM
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#62. "RE: Problem still not addressed"
In response to Reply # 57


Solingen, DE
          

Update: Nikon Software Engineering asked some questions which I answered.

Wolfgang

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 03:18 AM
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#63. "Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 0


Apex, US
          

I have been exchanging e-mails about my color management problem with one of the lead developers at Nik since April. He tried giving me some modules that log debug information and he put some focus on the problem. However, the support developers were still having problems figuring out what was going on. I was told that they actually bought a W500 laptop from eBay and were finally able to debug the color management problem. I was given early access to 2.2.6, and it appears that finally the colors in the edit window render correctly when my ThinkPad is set to use high performance graphics mode. I don't know when NX2 2.2.6 will be released, but I was told that I could talk about it and this fix on Nikonians.

So yes, there are people actively working on support for NX2 and they really do care about improving the product. Hopefully this bodes well for subsequent fix levels and future releases of this product.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 09:19 AM
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#64. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 63


San Jose, US
          

Thanks for the update Danny. I guess that also means NX3 is still a way off.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 12:52 PM
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#65. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 64


Apex, US
          

I've poked and prodded trying to get hints about NX3, but have not gotten any more information about a future release than what has been hinted at in various sources online.

I wouldn't say that the delivery of support and fix packs for the current release implies anything about the next release. Most software development organizations (including where I work) have support groups handling the release that is currently in the field while the development groups are working on future releases.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 01:31 PM
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#66. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 65


Rochester, US
          

Danny: I put a post out in the printer++ forum,
http://www.nikonians.org/forums/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=198&topic_id=20572&mesg_id=20572&page=
It is a side show on this thread, but as a long shot wonder if you might have stumbled onto this related issue of printing trouble with new PC/system combinations. I do not have the problem you mention using my Lenovo Tablet PC, nor the new super-PC I recently installed. Monitor rendering and calibration seem fine. It is printing that has fallen, even using the exact same files printed previously, and via NX2 and PS-CS5 (can't tell the difference--both are too flat). Any wisdom on this? I'm getting suspicious of my printer, which has been dormant too long in any case.

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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gol4man Registered since 11th Jul 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 02:11 PM
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#67. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 66


Jupiter, US
          

Have you turned off the Printer Color Controls. If you turn it off somewhere in the printer options, then the software ie. NX2 or CS5 will control the print output. It should look like what you see on the monitor

  

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JazzDoc Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his generous support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Mar 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 02:24 PM
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#68. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 67


Rochester, US
          

Yes, I certainly have turned off color adjustments in the printer driver. I wonder if there is some deep menu that has some odd setting that I am not considering. Also, the part about the inks staying fallow--I have yet to shake the carts as suggested by Ernesto, or replace them for that matter. That will be next. The photo I sent to BayPhoto for a test run looks just like an earlier print by my 3800, and is far closer to the monitor image than current prints, which look like browns and reds, for example, appear flatter than normal.

Gary Paige

my gallery

www.frontpaige-photography.com

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 04:21 PM
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#69. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 66


Apex, US
          

I have a 3800 also. However, I have never actually printed from NX2, so I'm afraid I won't be much help for this particular issue.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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gol4man Registered since 11th Jul 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 04:34 PM
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#70. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 69


Jupiter, US
          

I am on a brand new Dell Studio XPS 8100 with windows 7 since Feb and use an old Canon i9900 and it has worked perfectly from the start.I only print from NX2 unless i need a set a different canvas size then I use Elements since I cannot figure out how to set a different canvas size such as for greeting cards or for that matter how to add in text.

  

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robsb Platinum Member Fellow Ribbon awarded for his expertise in CNX2 and his always amicable and continuous efforts to help members Laureate Ribbon awarded for winning in the Best of Nikonians 2013 images Photo Contest Donor Ribbon awarded for his enthusiastic and repeated support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 23rd Aug 2006Tue 21-Sep-10 08:40 PM
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#71. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 65
Tue 21-Sep-10 08:42 PM by robsb

San Jose, US
          

Yeah in hindsight, I agree with your assessment; it could be two different groups.

Bob Baldassano
My Nikonians Gallery

"Nikonians membership - My most important photographic investment, after the
camera"

Retirement is a gift of time - Don't waste it!

  

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odenthal Silver Member Nikonian since 21st Oct 2006Fri 12-Nov-10 09:06 AM
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#72. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 63


Solingen, DE
          

The problem is solved with NX 2.2.6 for my Lenovo T500.

Wolfgang


>I have been exchanging e-mails about my color management
>problem with one of the lead developers at Nik since April.
>He tried giving me some modules that log debug information and
>he put some focus on the problem. However, the support
>developers were still having problems figuring out what was
>going on. I was told that they actually bought a W500 laptop
>from eBay and were finally able to debug the color management
>problem. I was given early access to 2.2.6, and it appears
>that finally the colors in the edit window render correctly
>when my ThinkPad is set to use high performance graphics mode.
> I don't know when NX2 2.2.6 will be released, but I was told
>that I could talk about it and this fix on Nikonians.
>
>So yes, there are people actively working on support for NX2
>and they really do care about improving the product.
>Hopefully this bodes well for subsequent fix levels and future
>releases of this product.
>
>Danny
>>size="2"]A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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TiggerGTO Silver Member Nikonian since 22nd Feb 2006Fri 12-Nov-10 03:47 PM
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#73. "RE: Finally, I have a fix"
In response to Reply # 72


Apex, US
          

I have been happily running 2.2.6 on my laptop since it came out. The color management problem for the high performance graphics on this family of laptops is definitely history.

Danny
A Nikonian in North Carolina

  

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