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Forums Lobby GET TO KNOW YOUR CAMERA & MASTER IT Nikon D5300/D5200/D5100/D5000/D3300/D3200/D3100/D3000 (Public) topic #7507
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Subject: "D5100 Battery" Previous topic | Next topic
arc2456 Registered since 24th Jan 2013Thu 24-Jan-13 07:07 AM
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"D5100 Battery"


Pickering, CA
          

I am looking to get an additional battery for my new camera.
Looking at the Nikon site the price is twice as expensive as what it is in they USA.
Why is the EN-EL14 battery so expensive in Canada?

  

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Trimax Registered since 07th Jan 2013Sun 27-Jan-13 03:33 PM
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#1. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 0


Madrid, ES
          

This one has a chip for unblocking the original checking.

Patona compatible Nikon EN-EL-14

______________________________________________________________________________________

I had got a Minolta Dynax 5xi with AF 28–85 mm f/3.5-4.5 (Original, RS).
Now I have the Nikon D5100 with AF 18-105mm VR DX.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Fri 08-Feb-13 04:44 PM
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#2. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 1
Fri 08-Feb-13 04:44 PM by NikonOz

US
          

>This one has a chip for unblocking the original checking.



What does the chip for unblocking the original checking do?

Can I buy any after market battery which is described as a replacement for the original D5100 or there is more to it?

  

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coolmom42 Silver Member Awarded for her enthusiastic support of the community and exemplifying the Nikonian mission “Share, Learn and Inspire” Nikonian since 01st Dec 2011Fri 08-Feb-13 10:15 PM
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#3. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 2


McEwen, US
          

Generally people do not get very good service out of the after-market batteries. They simply don't have the storage capacity of the OEM Nikons.

They are probably higher in Canada due to import duties.

I'm not familiar with the chip issue.

working on it in Middle TN
Nikon D3100

35 mm 1.8 Nikkor
18-55 mm Nikkor VR
55-200 mm Nikkor VR
55-300 mm Nikkor VR
150-500 mm Sigma OS
Feisol CT3471 & Markins M20 ballhead

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Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Writer Ribbon awarded for his contributions to the Nikonians Resources articles library Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Fri 08-Feb-13 11:08 PM
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#4. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 2
Fri 08-Feb-13 11:10 PM by Leonard62

Hatboro, Pa, US
          

Nikon has tried to discourage 3rd party battery makers from copying their batteries by having the dslr bodies that use the EN-EL14 recognize original Nikon batteries and to reject 3rd party batteries. This worked for awhile until these 3rd party makers reverse engineered the Nikon protection chips and started to add these chips into their products. I personally won't buy these 3rd party batteries.

Len

edit: And to the original poster I find it is curious that the same battery is so much more costly in Canada versus the US.

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Sat 09-Feb-13 08:08 AM
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#5. "RE: D5100 Battery - Warning Canadian Ranting About High Prices"
In response to Reply # 4


Fort Kent, CA
          

There is really no good reason why the same battery (produced in China I'm sure) should sell for $109 in Canada and $49 in the US. I just checked on line at Bestbuy.ca vs Bestbuy.com and that is the price difference. I did notice that Bestbuy.ca is offering their house brand Digipower battery for the D5100 at $49.00. I might be tempted to try one of those.

This issue was the subject of a news story today at: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2013/02/07/marketplace-country-pricing.html?cmp=rss and apparently there is some Senate Committee looking into the problem (not that I'd pin much hope on any change as a result of that inquest).

I did luck out one day and found an "open box" sale at Best Buy for an accessory kit for the D5100 that included a battery, camera case and other goodies, but because the box was damaged it was on clearance. The total package was 50% the cost of the battery. I didn't want or need the case or the other goodies, but got the battery I needed for about $60 instead of $110, and the goodies were just gravy.

I also was tempted by the real cheap ones on eBay, but after finding lots of people complaining they did not work I decided not to waste my money. I did read that while the cheapo's may not work directly in the camera, if you buy the cheapo battery pack that takes two batteries, and use a real Nikon on one side you can use a cheapo on the other. The battery pack and a pair of cheapo's was about $40 if I remember correctly, ... that is still a little tempting. Anyone here prepared to admit they use that set up?

BTW this price difference between the US & Canada is fueling a multi-billion dollar cross boarder shopping spree. One thing I did learn shopping in the USA, some retailers no longer accept Canadian Credit Cards, (Visa or MC or whatever) because you MUST have a ZIP code. I even found gas stations in the mid-west that would not take my card. They pointed to their over priced cash machine and said withdraw the cash (for a fee) and then buy your gas with the cash. I said that was not very friendly to Canadian visitors, they said they don't get many Canadians ... no wonder. I learned quickly to stick with Exxon and Shell who did take my card. Even shopping on line can be a problem without a validated ZIP code, retailers like Newegg.com won't take my Visa. (Bestbuy.com by the way does allow me to use my card).

So, note to self, next time I'm in the good ol' US of A, pick up another Nikon battery at less than half price.

FKD
Alberta CANADA

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Sat 09-Feb-13 02:16 PM
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#6. "RE: D5100 Battery - Warning Canadian Ranting About High Prices"
In response to Reply # 5


US
          

I pulled a trigger on a cheap 'decoded' battery that clearly said that it works with my DSLR (D5100). It will take a while to arrive for China.

Others did that already and reported full compatibility with listed DSLRs. Look at reviews on Amazon.

Lithium-ion cells are cheap.

Nikon one is 7.7Wh....one can buy a premium power drill 54Wh battery for $100 at local hardware stores. If looking at Wh numbers alone the Nikon pack would sell there at $14 and that is the price the after market packs go for (shipped).

  

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pjonesCET Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Jul 2011Sat 09-Feb-13 04:20 PM
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#7. "RE: D5100 Battery - Warning Canadian Ranting About High Prices"
In response to Reply # 5
Sun 10-Feb-13 03:35 PM by pjonesCET

Martinsville, US
          

I would seriously advise anyone unless you actually physically know the person (a relative you know to be trustworthy, or friend you've known for 30 years or more) not to buy anything on eBay. When first started the originators tried to enforce honesty. But as thing got bigger. Its impossible to do. There are plenty of people that will sell anything even if broken as top quality stuff.

If you've got to do this Try amazon instead. They are stricter on the honest of vendors they allow to sell used stuff. And they offer several vendors for each product to sell new products. They have a Rating system. There seems to be a little more Honesty.

Phillip M Jones, CET
pjonescet@comcast.net
http://www.phillipmjones.net/

Visit my Nikonians gallery.


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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Sun 10-Feb-13 04:53 PM
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#8. "RE: D5100 Battery - eBay Shopping"
In response to Reply # 7


Fort Kent, CA
          

I don't agree with a blanket "don't shop eBay".

It really is a "buyer's beware" market. Consider it an electronic garage sale or "Dollar Store". I shop at both sometimes.

Over the years I've bought 100's of items down by dBay and I've never had any serious problems, and the couple of hic ups I've had have been rectified by the seller.

I've bought electronics, video games, many many hand-crafted teddy bears (my wife's passion) and stuff for my other passion ~model railroading. And several gadgets for my camera.

So far so good.

As for quality, much of the cheaper stuff is "Dollar Store" quality, but for those of us on a budget we do shop at the dollar store and while that gift bag for 50 cents is not the same quality as the Hallmark one for $4.00, it does the job just as well and when I'm handing out two dozen Christmas presents at my staff's Christmas Party, that's $42 in my pocket and not Hallmarks.

But the brand name stuff I've bought seems to me to be exactly the same as the original. (Maybe it is "seconds" but I've never noticed??)

Camera stuff I've bought include 'star filers' - a novelty item that put me back about $10 for four. a flash diffuser, a wireless shutter release (Yongnuo - works great), step up rings, replacement strap, and the list goes on. I did buy a brand name Kenko Polarizing filer, for way less than half the price they want for the same thing at the camera shop, I've used it, seems to work as it should, tried the test on the video monitor and yep, turn it right and you see the monitor, turn a bit more and you you see a black hole. I lost the lens cap on my camera. Could not believe the price at the camera store. Bought half a dozen for less than half the price one would have cost me, it works, it says Nikon (unlike the camera store which was a generic). I can't tell the difference. Same thing goes for those little hot-shoe covers, I bought a half dozen with a wee level bubble in them. Work like a charm, cheap like borscht. Stuff like that, go for it.

As for less than honest eBay seller ~ that may be true but I've not had that problem. Once I've had good service from any seller they go into my trusted seller list and that helps.

Keep in mind I'm comparing these eBay bargains to our heavily over inflated Canadian prices. I'm sorry but the price difference is just too much to pass up. And I live 3 hours from the city and only go there a few times a year so if I want something mail-order is one way I can get it faster. That may not be the case for my urban friends who can pop down to Best Buy or a big camera store for their needs.

Having said all that, I did not buy my camera on eBay. Again I think of it like shopping at the Dollar Store, cheap but not always top grade products.

That's why I hesitated on buying cheapo batteries. I was concerned that a cheap battery with poor quality control may put out the wrong voltage, watt or whatever which may damage my camera, and I did see lots of comments that they did not work. That may have been fixed now I'll be watching to see how the OP's decision works out for him.

Like the saying goes, Buyer Beware and if you are comfortable with the risk, go for it. Like my papa taught me, never buy a parachute on sale.


FKD
Alberta CANADA

  

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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Sun 10-Feb-13 05:02 PM
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#9. "RE: D5100 Battery - Warning Canadian Ranting About High Prices"
In response to Reply # 7


Fort Kent, CA
          

>I would seriously advise anyone u...not
>to buy anything on eBay. ...
>If you've got to do this Try amazon instead. They are stricter
>on the honest of vendors they allow to sell used stuff. And
>they offer several vendors for each product to sell new
>products. They have a Rating system. There seems to be a
>little more Honesty.

I do compare prices with Amazon.ca to eBay but sometimes Amazon is more expensive than say Bestbuy.ca or other retailers.

For example I'm considering the Yongnuo YN-565EX flash as a second flash. Sure I'd rather get a Nikon, but the price difference for a second flash is hard to justify. (yes I know CLS won't work).

Here's what I'm facing when considering a second flash:

YN-565EX: eBay's price $159,
Amazon.ca $279,

Vs a SB900 $575 (Amazon.ca) or even a second SB700 @ $350ish

For a second flash to operate as an optical slave, the savings it just too much to overlook.

  

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mareng Registered since 14th Jan 2013Sun 10-Feb-13 06:27 PM
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#10. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 4
Sun 10-Feb-13 06:30 PM by mareng

Thatcham. GB, UK
          

The prices for the EN-EL14 battery in England with the prices converted to US$ are $78.99 but includes tax@ 20% that is for the genuine Nikon one. $22 for the (who knows what you are buying) one.

With a lot of items in the States we pay in £'s what you pay in $'s.

When things are too good to be true, they are probably not.

I did see a video of inserting a genuine Nikon battery into a two battery pack and adding a pirate battery which fools the camera, then replacing the Nikon battery with another pirate battery. But then with heavy use would the pirate batteries fail and damage the camera.
Can you take that chance on a $500 -$1000 camera.
Photography is an expensive but exciting hobby, or you could just be a couch potato and watch the soaps.

Mareng

  

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MEMcD Moderator In depth knowledge in various areas Nikonian since 24th Dec 2007Sun 10-Feb-13 07:23 PM
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#11. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 0


US
          

Hi Tony,

Wow! That is crazy but true.
I think you should ask Nikon Canada since they are the only ones that can answer that question.

Comparing the List Price or SRP of the batteries at W ower Accessories" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Nikon Canada to Nikon USA the EN-EL14 is $89.95 CD and $40.95 USD though other batteries like the EN-EL18 ($199.95) is less expensive in Cananda than the ($220.00) in the USA.

So the pricing policy doesn't seem to have a pattern.
Good Luck and Enjoy your Nikons!

Best Regards,
Marty

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Writer Ribbon awarded for his contributions to the Nikonians Resources articles library Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Sun 10-Feb-13 11:00 PM
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#12. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 11


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

Marty, B&H sells the EN-EL18 for &139.95, Adorama for $136.95. I don't know if anybody is selling it for list price. In comparison Henry's in Canada sells it for $199.99.

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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MEMcD Moderator In depth knowledge in various areas Nikonian since 24th Dec 2007Mon 11-Feb-13 12:26 AM
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#13. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 12


US
          

Hi Len,

Berger Bros sells the EN-EL18 for $199.95 and Calumet sells it for $179.95. Some Dealers in the USA discount more, others discount less, others don't discount at all.

This doesn't change the fact that the EN-EL14 List price is more that twice as much in Canada than it is the the USA.


Since Henry's is selling the EN-EL18 for the Canadian list price, and Best Buy Canada has the EN-EL14 selling at $109.95 ($20.00 over the Canadian List Price) it would lead one to the conclusion that Canadian Retailers are not discounting. The question is Why?
Is it the Dealers wanting to maintaining a higher profit margin or is there another reason.
Good Luck and Enjoy your Nikons!

Best Regards,
Marty

  

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Leonard62 Gold Member Awarded for excellent contributions and sharing his in-depth knowledge and experience with the community, especially of Nikkor Lenses Writer Ribbon awarded for his contributions to the Nikonians Resources articles library Nikonian since 15th Mar 2009Mon 11-Feb-13 03:22 AM
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#14. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 13


Hatboro, Pa, US
          

Nikon and Leica and I'm sure other camera companies hold their dealers to minimum prices they can sell some or all of their products. If they sell below these prices they can lose their status as an authorized dealer. In the case of Nikon it is their bodies and most lenses. It appears that batteries are not on the list. It may be that Nikon Canada also has batteries on the minimum sales price list. The only other thing I can think of is maybe Canada has higher duty on imported batteries.

Len

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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MEMcD Moderator In depth knowledge in various areas Nikonian since 24th Dec 2007Mon 11-Feb-13 03:52 AM
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#15. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 14


US
          

Hi Len,

I know that is Nikon's policy in the USA and is likely the case in Canada as well. If batteries are included in Nikon Canada's policy any Canadian Nikon Authorized Dealer should be able to confirm.

I was thinking the same thing regarding the higher import duties or some law or special tax on Li-ion batteries. Though if that was the case, the additonal cost should be reflected in the Manufactures List Prices across the board. However the EN-EL4a and the EN-EL18 both have a lower list price in Canada.
Good Luck and Enjoy your Nikons!

Best Regards,
Marty

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Mon 11-Feb-13 10:54 PM
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#16. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 15


US
          

My $14.99 (delivered!) EL14 pack just arrived (from USA not China as I stated incorrectly).

Included was:

- nice colorful box looking just like any other retail box
- a sticker on box with: MADE IN CHINA
- printed user manual
- pack wrapped in a plastic bag with plastic cap on the end where the contacts are

The pack case build quality is in pair with the Nikon pack I have.

The initial voltage was healthy.

The final voltage after charging it with Nikon charger was healthy, 4.18V/cell.

My D5100 had no issue recognizing it.

Overall a very nice product. The manufacturing cost must be few bucks.

  

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pjonesCET Gold Member Donor Ribbon awarded for his support to the Fundraising Campaign 2014 Nikonian since 11th Jul 2011Mon 11-Feb-13 11:49 PM
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#17. "RE: D5100 Battery - eBay Shopping"
In response to Reply # 8


Martinsville, US
          

WE had some Friend bought something from eBay and lost several Thousand Dollars. Ebay did nothing to help. The supposed seller strung them along and milked a few extra hundred dollars or so.

I have had other friend bit by eBay Trading. Never had any reports from amazon. I've even bought items From Amazon used and new never had an issue.

Phillip M Jones, CET
pjonescet@comcast.net
http://www.phillipmjones.net/

Visit my Nikonians gallery.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/pjonescet/
http://www.phillipjones-cet.net

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Tue 12-Feb-13 12:23 AM
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#18. "RE: D5100 Battery - eBay Shopping"
In response to Reply # 17


US
          

Ebay is not Amazon and Paypal is not a bank. Yes, some people did loose big money there. When buying and selling expensive items one needs to be very careful.

I buy $15 items from people with solid feedback with no hesitation.

Stay safe!

  

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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Wed 13-Feb-13 01:53 AM
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#19. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 16


Fort Kent, CA
          

>My $14.99 (delivered!) EL14 pack just arrived (from USA not
>China as I stated incorrectly).
>
>Included was:
>
>- nice colorful box looking just like any other retail box
>- a sticker on box with: MADE IN CHINA
>- printed user manual
>- pack wrapped in a plastic bag with plastic cap on the end
>where the contacts are
>
>The pack case build quality is in pair with the Nikon pack I
>have.
>
>The initial voltage was healthy.
>
>The final voltage after charging it with Nikon charger was
>healthy, 4.18V/cell.
>
>My D5100 had no issue recognizing it.
>
>Overall a very nice product. The manufacturing cost must be
>few bucks.


O do tell where did you order that battery from?

FKD
Alberta CANADA

  

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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Wed 13-Feb-13 01:55 AM
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#20. "RE: D5100 Battery - eBay Shopping"
In response to Reply # 17


Fort Kent, CA
          

>WE had some Friend bought something from eBay and lost
>several Thousand Dollars. Ebay did nothing to help. The
>supposed seller strung them along and milked a few extra
>hundred dollars or so.
>
>I have had other friend bit by eBay Trading. Never had any
>reports from amazon. I've even bought items From Amazon used
>and new never had an issue.

Oh, I don't think I would spend more than a couple hundred dollars on an eBay order and then only from a trusted seller with whom I've had good service.

FKD
Alberta CANADA

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 02:12 AM
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#21. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 19


US
          

Here is a link to the US seller:

http://stores.ebay.com/multi-function1002/_i.html?_nkw=EN-EL14&submit=Search&_sid=1001025334

Let me know if the link does not work.

  

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jec6613 Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 02:43 AM
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#22. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 16


Norwalk, US
          

>- a sticker on box with: MADE IN CHINA

FYI, per labeling laws, that simply means that final assembly was in China, you have no idea where the cells came from without hooking up a SBS reader.

I don't do third party simply because of future compatibility problems. I know that the D5200 will work with my batteries, for instance, but older third party ones won't work. Also, I managed to get mine on the cheap, but that's my luck.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 01:30 PM
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#23. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 22


US
          


>FYI, per labeling laws, that simply means that final assembly
>was in China, you have no idea where the cells came from
>without hooking up a SBS reader.

I have no idea where my underwear come from and where children toys the kids chew on come from. I am more concern about toxic dyes used on these products than over a camera battery.

90% of things we buy come from Asia and we have no clue who manufactures them. Why is it a concern now?

I doubt that these Ebay imports even care about some US labeling law.

Americans buy huge number of "no-name" batteries from Asia. I see that in the remote control toys/hobby industry too. US is flooded with these quality batteries sold for a fraction of what similar packs go for in brick stores.


>I don't do third party simply because of future compatibility
>problems. I know that the D5200 will work with my batteries,
>for instance, but older third party ones won't work. Also, I
>managed to get mine on the cheap, but that's my luck.

I doubt that someone in Asia would build a factory to supply products for Ebay market only. I would speculate that these factories produce batteries for brand names electronic manufacturers only. I doubt that they would make "Ebay" packs to a different standards.

Battery is simple to make. It either work or it does not. Given the currents the pack does not need to be super high technologically advanced cutting edge. It is the same pack that is in your cell phone.

  

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jec6613 Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 08:24 PM
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#24. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 23


Norwalk, US
          

>90% of things we buy come from Asia and we have no clue who
>manufactures them. Why is it a concern now?
>
>I doubt that these Ebay imports even care about some US
>labeling law.
>
>Americans buy huge number of "no-name" batteries
>from Asia. I see that in the remote control toys/hobby
>industry too. US is flooded with these quality batteries sold
>for a fraction of what similar packs go for in brick stores.

...

>I doubt that someone in Asia would build a factory to supply
>products for Ebay market only. I would speculate that these
>factories produce batteries for brand names electronic
>manufacturers only. I doubt that they would make
>"Ebay" packs to a different standards.
>
>Battery is simple to make. It either work or it does not.
>Given the currents the pack does not need to be super high
>technologically advanced cutting edge. It is the same pack
>that is in your cell phone.

Your statement holds true for Alkaline cells and other single cell batteries, but for Li-Ion packs this is not the case. There are three parts to a Li-Ion battery pack: the cells, the casing and the control circuit board. The, "Made in China," stamp simply means that they were assembled in China, however there are few Li-Ion cells actually made there, so likely only the control board and the casing were made in China. Origin labeling laws are strictly enforced by CBP on any Li-Ion shipment because of the potential danger involved.

Li-Ion batteries are sufficiently dangerous they have grounded the Boeing 787 Dreamliner, while it was still equipped with the best cells available; a Li-Ion fire cannot be put out, starts spontaneously and is much more likely to occur with a third party battery than a first party (although it's rare with either). This is why the control board is in there: it monitors the health of the individual cells in the pack, and instructs the charger how to charge the battery, and provides the status readout for the camera's battery level. It tracks every single charge/discharge cycle, the level the battery was charged or discharged to, and every other detail. Yes, this means that the intelligence in the battery is actually in the battery itself, not the camera or charger, which are dumb units. This is all described by the IBM/Toshiba/Duracell joint specification on Smart Batteries, developed in the 1990's for the IBM ThinkPad to allow it to use different battery chemistries at any time (it still does that today, but as the vast majority of cells are Li-Ion, that part of the specification is fairly irrelevant). That same SBS (Smart Battery Subsystem) chips is entirely responsible for the safe running of the battery: preventing dangerous overcharge situations and the like, and all-in-all, the small chip on a modern Li-Ion battery has as much computing power as the Gemini spacecraft.

On top of all of the above, Nikon uses a cryptological lockout on their batteries control boards to ensure you only use first party ones. This, of course, has been reverse engineered, to a point, but Nikon does keep coming up with newer ways to lock out third party batteries. Each new camera body may and usually does include a new method to lock out third party batteries, which must be circumvented by newer knock-off designs.

While the factory I'm sure does not produce only for eBay, saying that it produces for major manufacturers is taking a very US-centric point of view: these knock-off batteries are exceedingly popular in Asia, India and developing markets, the US importation is simply a lucrative side business where they can sell the knock-off batteries for many times their original price. I recently visited DXB, and saw the knock-off EN-EL14's being sold for 25 AED - that works out to under $7 for a battery pack, and they looked just like the ones on eBay. The cells may be from the same place as the Nikon ones, but, read above: the important part is less so the cells and more so the control circuits.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 10:29 PM
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#25. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 24
Thu 14-Feb-13 01:10 AM by NikonOz

US
          

I am sure all these sellers adhere to the strict rules of CBP just like the manufacturers there adhere to environmental rules, and governments to human rights.

Why does it matter who made the cell and the packaging?

Why does it matter that all LiPo, Li-Ion, LiFePo4, NiCd, NiMh can burst into fire due to manufacturers defects or mishandling?

There might be some quality control issue with cheaper packs, true, use it or don't. However it is not as complicated as you are trying to show in your post. It is the cell, charging and protection circuit, and the plastic case. All is so cheap to make that I feel confident that they designed and manufactured it right.

"Each new camera body may and usually does include a new method to lock out third party batteries, which must be circumvented by newer knock-off designs." We spent only $15 on this thing that will be in garbage before we buy the new body.

Millions of aftermarket packs are in use and I am thankful for being able to buy some just like the aftermarket car parts, ink cartridges, lenses, you name it.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Wed 13-Feb-13 10:48 PM
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#26. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 25
Wed 13-Feb-13 10:49 PM by NikonOz

US
          

If you are super worry you can do these steps, should do with Nikon pack too then:

- Measure the terminal voltage on your original pack.
- Measure the terminal voltage on the new pack.
- Charge the new pack and measure the voltage again.

The voltage in all cases should be in range of 3–4.2 V per cell. Which is 6 to 8.4V in case of 2 cell EL14.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_battery

Fully charged pack will be close to 8.4V or slightly under.

  

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Fortkentdad Registered since 01st Sep 2012Thu 14-Feb-13 03:25 PM
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#27. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 21


Fort Kent, CA
          

>Here is a link to the US seller:
>
>http://stores.ebay.com/multi-function1002/_i.html?_nkw=EN-EL14&submit=Search&_sid=1001025334
>
>Let me know if the link does not work.
>

Link worked but the seller does not sell to Canada. I wonder why a seller would chose to limit their market like that? Oh well it was worth a try.

FKD
Alberta CANADA

  

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gkaiseril Gold Member Nikonian since 28th Oct 2005Thu 14-Feb-13 04:01 PM
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#28. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 26


Chicago, US
          

Many posters have stated that the Nikon batteries last longer than 3rd party products for a single charge and the length of life of the battery.

LiON batteries store more energy than carbon zinc or alkaline and Lithium is far more reactive than many other metals. The purity of the chemicals can make a big difference in battery performance over their life. The electronics within the battery should prevent overloads from burning up the LiON battery. Nikon also included circuitry for measuring the battery life. When 3rd party batteries first appeared for the D200 many had the wrong electronic chips and could not power up the D200.

If you think a LiON battery cannot get hot or the quality of the electronic circuitry is not important just ask Boeing or find someone whose cell phone burst into flames or a laptop user who burned then legs. You will have to go back t0 2005 to locate articles about thi

Nikon also has a service advisory recalls for the EN-EL3and <www.nikonusa.com/en/Service-And-Support/Service-Advisories/h0ndzaip/EN-EL15-Rechargeable-Li-ion-Battery-Pack-Recall.html|EN-EL15> batteries. Note that the EN-EL3 recall is still available and the replacement is free.

George
My Nikonian Galleries

  

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jec6613 Silver Member Nikonian since 12th Feb 2013Thu 14-Feb-13 05:43 PM
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#29. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 25


Norwalk, US
          

>
>Why does it matter who made the cell and the packaging?
>
>Why does it matter that all LiPo, Li-Ion, LiFePo4, NiCd, NiMh
>can burst into fire due to manufacturers defects or
>mishandling?
>

It is exactly as complicated as I'm making it sound - if you are shipping just Li-Ion batteries without the electronics in the box, they are treated as explosives when entering the US and checked accordingly. If you're surprised, you don't know how dangerous the little buggers are. They are far and away more reactive than other types. Other examples of agencies that have had to put in restrictions due to past problems: OSHA requires that a bomb box and thermal monitoring at 100 times per second be used whenever working with the bare cells and solder or welding. This is not required with any other battery chemistry.

Unlike a Ni-MH fire, or a Ni-Cad fire, a Lithium fire, particularly with Li-Ion batteries, cannot be put out, it must burn itself to exhaustion, so if you get thermal runaway, you're toast. Cell phone and camera batteries may be small and relative annoyances, but the larger ones especially are a real problem. This is also why no Li-Ion cells can be carried in an airplane's hold when it is carrying passengers, they must be carry-on and even then only up to a certain size. Larger Li-Ion cells (including some high capacity laptop batteries) or larger concentrations of them must be carried aboard cargo aircraft without passengers aboard; that's right, the FAA has deemed them too dangerous to even be in an airplane's cargo hold with you on board (and, yes, the TSA will pull you off the plane if they detect Li-Ion cells in your luggage upon X-Ray inspection, I've seen them do it).

I carry Li-Ion cells with me all of the time, with my cell phones, laptop, cameras, and so on, but it doesn't mean that I'm unaware of their risks.

Now, back to cameras, some third party batteries are going to be okay, but you're rolling the dice with them, and hoping that their protection circuitry was programmed properly (it's individually programmed to each battery pack at the factory, and varies with the cells in the pack). At least if a Nikon battery burns up my Nikon camera, I'm covered.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Thu 14-Feb-13 06:29 PM
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#30. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 27


US
          

>>Here is a link to the US seller:
>>
>>http://stores.ebay.com/multi-function1002/_i.html?_nkw=EN-EL14&submit=Search&_sid=1001025334
>>
>>Let me know if the link does not work.
>>
>
>Link worked but the seller does not sell to Canada. I wonder
>why a seller would chose to limit their market like that? Oh
>well it was worth a try.
>
>

There are zillions of sellers. Sometimes US sellers just by default have USA only selected on their profile. I would contact the seller or get it from a different one.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Thu 14-Feb-13 06:45 PM
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#31. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 29


US
          

You can't be serious!


>It is exactly as complicated as I'm making it sound - if you
>are shipping just Li-Ion batteries without the electronics in
>the box, they are treated as explosives when entering the US

As explosives? LOL! What do they do? Call the bomb squad for each package that continues Li-xx pack?

The US market is overran by shipments of unprotected LiPo packs used for remote control models. These "bombs" have many more times more energy than EL14. One RC pack can wight as much as your DSLR.

I have had shipped 2lb of these unprotected packs from Asia. No bomb squad involved.


>and checked accordingly. If you're surprised, you don't know
>how dangerous the little buggers are. They are far and away
>more reactive than other types. Other examples of agencies
>that have had to put in restrictions due to past problems:
>OSHA requires that a bomb box and thermal monitoring at 100
>times per second be used whenever working with the bare cells
>and solder or welding. This is not required with any other
>battery chemistry.

A bomb box? For what? To work on EL14? LOL!!! May be for working on a utility 500Lb generator backup battery but please get things into perspective.


>
>Unlike a Ni-MH fire, or a Ni-Cad fire, a Lithium fire,
>particularly with Li-Ion batteries, cannot be put out, it must
>burn itself to exhaustion, so if you get thermal runaway,
>you're toast. Cell phone and camera batteries may be small
>and relative annoyances, but the larger ones especially are a
>real problem.

So the EL14 one is the larger one from those mention?

>This is also why no Li-Ion cells can be carried
>in an airplane's hold when it is carrying passengers, they
>must be carry-on and even then only up to a certain size.
>Larger Li-Ion cells (including some high capacity laptop
>batteries) or larger concentrations of them must be carried
>aboard cargo aircraft without passengers aboard; that's right,
>the FAA has deemed them too dangerous to even be in an
>airplane's cargo hold with you on board (and, yes, the TSA
>will pull you off the plane if they detect Li-Ion cells in
>your luggage upon X-Ray inspection, I've seen them do it).

We talking about 48g pack here.

I am done talking on this topic as this is getting ridicules discussing bomb boxes on this forum.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Thu 14-Feb-13 06:49 PM
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#32. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 28
Thu 14-Feb-13 06:50 PM by NikonOz

US
          

>Many posters have stated that the Nikon batteries last longer
>than 3rd party products for a single charge and the length of
>life of the battery.
>
>LiON batteries store more energy than carbon zinc or alkaline
>and Lithium is far more reactive than many other metals. The
>purity of the chemicals can make a big difference in battery
>performance over their life. The electronics within the
>battery should prevent overloads from burning up the LiON
>battery. Nikon also included circuitry for measuring the
>battery life. When 3rd party batteries first appeared for the
>D200 many had the wrong electronic chips and could not power
>up the D200.
>
>If you think a LiON battery cannot get hot or the quality of
>the electronic circuitry is not important just ask Boeing or
>find someone whose cell phone burst into flames or a laptop
>user who burned then legs. You will have to go back t0 2005 to
>locate articles about thi
>
>Nikon also has a service advisory recalls for the
>EN-EL3and
><www.nikonusa.com/en/Service-And-Support/Service-Advisories/h0ndzaip/EN-EL15-Rechargeable-Li-ion-Battery-Pack-Recall.html|EN-EL15>
>batteries. Note that the EN-EL3 recall is still available and
>the replacement is free.
>

Yes, nikon got it wrong "The battery pack can experience a short circuit causing it to overheat"

Yes, the Asia manufacturer can get it wrong too.

If I had this paranoia about everything, I would not drive, fly, carry ipod with me...

If you paid $1000 for your body buy Nikon accessories. Many did not spend that much on body, lens, and all accessories combined.

  

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gkaiseril Gold Member Nikonian since 28th Oct 2005Thu 14-Feb-13 08:07 PM
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#33. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 32


Chicago, US
          

Do not forget going on an ocean cruise.

It is about statistics and the risk you are willing to take. I do not think the Nikon issue is a big problem and probably safer than driving. But I would rather not burn up my camera or have the battery burn the circuitry.

Since there is an easy way to avoid the risk of a bad battery for free, why not take it.

I have survived a lot including being shot at with a 50 cal machine gun.

George
My Nikonian Galleries

  

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leithman Registered since 17th Feb 2013Sat 02-Mar-13 12:02 PM
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#34. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 0


UK
          

>I am looking to get an additional battery for my new camera.
>Looking at the Nikon site the price is twice as expensive as
>what it is in they USA.
>Why is the EN-EL14 battery so expensive in Canada?

First post and I thought this was a worthwhile topic.
I had read all the warnings about third party batteries and how the only way around using them was along with an original in a battery grip.
You will understand my trepidation when considering buying one but after a lot of thought I took the plunge and bought two.
I bought them from Amazon UK and after nearly three months of use i am very happy with them. I find they perform as well as the original Nikon EN-EL14. I suppose only time will tell if they are good long term investments, but at £30.00 UK for the two, they are certainly worth trying.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Sat 02-Mar-13 01:56 PM
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#35. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 34


US
          

I can't tell any difference either but I did not take any scientific approach here. It just works and that is what it counts in my books.

  

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arc2456 Registered since 24th Jan 2013Mon 11-Mar-13 10:04 PM
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#36. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 0


Pickering, CA
          

Saw a replacement battery in Future Shop from Digipower for $49.99, Says right on the package that it is for the D5100.

Also looking at the Best Buy site they have the same thing there

http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/digipower-digipower-lithium-ion-replacement-battery-for-nikon-en-el14-bp-nkl14-bp-nkl14/10221039.aspx?path=8646e77d47b272306c602f397f73456fen02

same price too.
Much better than the Nikon battery, the price on that one at Best Buy is $109.

Going to have to get one and see how it works, will update when I find out.

  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Mon 11-Mar-13 11:51 PM
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#37. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 36
Mon 11-Mar-13 11:54 PM by NikonOz

US
          

Digipower? I wonder how is this better in comparison to the $15 packs sold by US sellers on ebay?

Funny, the one ebay seller raised the price from $15 to $55. His packs where probably flying off the shelf after mentioning it here so he raised the price (he has sold 121 single packs via the one single auction I used to buy it). I wonder if they are 3.7 times better now! LOL


  

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NikonOz Registered since 07th Feb 2013Mon 11-Mar-13 11:58 PM
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#38. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 37
Tue 12-Mar-13 12:04 AM by NikonOz

US
          

They must get these packs for couple of bucks and resale here in US for as little as $8 shipped:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Replacement-EN-EL14-Battery-Pack-for-Nikon-P7000-/190705726630?pt=Batteries_Chargers&hash=item2c66f274a6

This one is not for Nikon D3100 so be careful.

You even get a cleaning kit with this one here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-EN-EL14-ENEL14-Battery-for-D5200-D3100-D5100-D3200-Digital-Camera-/171004949252?pt=Batteries_Chargers&hash=item27d0b07304

  

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arc2456 Registered since 24th Jan 2013Fri 15-Mar-13 04:39 PM
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#39. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 36
Fri 15-Mar-13 04:40 PM by arc2456

Pickering, CA
          

Battery bought and it works in the d5100. Now to see how well it works.
If it does well I will have to get another.

Tony

  

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arc2456 Registered since 24th Jan 2013Fri 10-May-13 11:27 PM
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#40. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 39


Pickering, CA
          

Well the new battery seems to be working great, no problems with it.
I will definitely go this route again, works as well as the Nikon original battery.

Tony

  

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avigar Silver Member Nikonian since 29th Nov 2006Sat 11-May-13 10:28 PM
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#41. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 40


Northern IL, US
          

Try the SterlingTek (STK) brand of camera batteries through Amazon. They're reliable and have used them on my Canon P&S cameras without problems. I'm pretty sure they'll work well on the Nikons if you don't want to spend the money on OEM's.

--Ben

  

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RockyNH Registered since 10th Apr 2013Wed 05-Jun-13 05:30 PM
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#42. "RE: D5100 Battery"
In response to Reply # 2


US
          

I have just stayed with the Nikon. Not worth it to me to have to worry about a 3rd party battery (mixed reviews) and also that the camera may not recognize them akk.

Pat in NH

  

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anymouse73 Silver Member Nikonian since 16th Jan 2013Thu 06-Jun-13 12:55 PM
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#43. "RE: D5100 Battery - eBay Shopping"
In response to Reply # 8


Philadelphia, US
          

I agree with FKD about ebay. Like wierd Al's song about it says: it's a worldwide garage sale. "Buyer Beware".
I, myself, have made some excellent purchases on eBay. Last year I found an immaculate and perfectly functioning Nikon N8008s for $40; and a pristine 28-85mm Nikkor lens to go with it for $120. (Also usable on my other Nikons) Shop around and contact the seller before making a purchase.
Nothing is ever 100% bad or 100% good. Just be realistic in your expectations.

Bob

Visit my Nikonians gallery.

  

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